Question:

I started my teen years in the mid-1950s, when Johnny Cash got his start…. and I’ve loved his music all of my life. America lost one of its GREATS with his death. I feel like part of my world has become empty. A poll a few years ago said that the most recognized American faces throughout the world was 1) Bob Hope, and 2) Johnny Cash. And we have lost them both this year. Very sad. He was truly loved by everyone. Barbara – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – > Johnny Cash died today due to complications from diabetes which resulted in > respiratory failure at the age of 71. > RIP, I loved his music.

Response:

Not to denigrate Bob. or Johnny, but Muhammad Ali wasn’t the top? Sleepy – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->I started my teen years in the mid-1950s, when Johnny Cash got his start…. >and I’ve loved his music all of my life. America lost one of its GREATS with >his death. I feel like part of my world has become empty. >A poll a few years ago said that the most recognized American faces throughout >the world was 1) Bob Hope, and 2) Johnny Cash. And we have lost them both this >year. Very sad. >He was truly loved by everyone. >Barbara > Johnny Cash died today due to complications from diabetes which resulted in > respiratory failure at the age of 71. > RIP, I loved his music.

Support bacteria. They’re the only culture some people have

Response:

> Not to denigrate Bob. or Johnny, but Muhammad Ali wasn’t the top?

And "Ahnold" no. 2?

Response:

Well now that he is a "Ghost Rider in the Sky" I truly hope he doesn’t end up in that "Burning Ring of Fire" RIP Johnny! Sleepy >I love that song. I was reading in the paper this morning that he was >released from the hospital and I told my husband, I don’t think Johnny’s >long for this world. Never knew it would be that short though. I’ll miss >him.

OK, so what’s the speed of dark?

Response:

I hope not too Sleepy and it is so good to see you back posting. I have missed you lots.  I hope you had a restful break. Di

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Well now that he is a "Ghost Rider in the Sky" I truly hope he doesn’t > end up in that "Burning Ring of Fire" > RIP Johnny! > Sleepy >I love that song. I was reading in the paper this morning that he was >released from the hospital and I told my husband, I don’t think Johnny’s >long for this world. Never knew it would be that short though. I’ll miss >him. > OK, so what’s the speed of dark?

Response:

Thanks Di, Yes it was very good for the soul(sic) I did a bit of lurking, but I killfiled threads left and right so as not to turn me away again. Things seem relatively nice here again, and even my pal Ted made an appearance! Sleepy – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – >I hope not too Sleepy and it is so good to see you back posting. I >have missed you lots.  I hope you had a restful break. >Di > Well now that he is a "Ghost Rider in the Sky" I truly hope he >doesn’t > end up in that "Burning Ring of Fire" > RIP Johnny! > Sleepy > >I love that song. I was reading in the paper this morning that he >was > >released from the hospital and I told my husband, I don’t think >Johnny’s > >long for this world. Never knew it would be that short though. I’ll >miss > >him. > OK, so what’s the speed of dark?

OK, so what’s the speed of dark?

Response:

I seen on CMT of an interview with Johnny and June which was probably done last year. Larry King will air his last show with Johnny this Sunday night, and with John Ritter. We lost two famous people. Actually, "The Ring Of Fire" song was written by June of her feelings for Johnny when she fell in love with him. She said in the interview that he was her soul mate. Both were married to other spouses when they met. Johnny told her he was going to marry her one day, and they eventually did. I liked the Highway Man song. May the man in Black RIP. Just as I learned of these deaths, I heard of Dale Jarrett’s crew chiefs wife and two sisters were killed when a drunk driver ran into them from behind in their limo and they were burned up alive in that crash. They were coming back from a Fleetwood Mac concert in Greensboro, NC. Three counts of 2nd degree murder by vehicle. A sad day indeed to the Music, Show, and Nascar industry. May all RIP. Kimberly Hedrick type 1, since 1974, at age 3.

Response:

I had also just heard about Dale Jarrett’s crew chiefs’ wife and sisters, Kimberly.  Horrible.   My thoughts and prayers go out to this family. I just lost a friend who I had known since we both 18 years old to a drunk driver.   She left a daughter, son and 5 granddaughter’s.  And a friend who will miss her the rest of her life.  Another totally senseless death due to a drunk driver. Best, Dot Type 2  Diag 8/2001 – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – ><Just as I learned of these deaths, I heard of Dale Jarrett’s crew chiefs wife and two sisters were killed when a drunk driver ran into them from behind in their limo and they were burned up alive in that crash. They were coming back from a Fleetwood Mac concert in Greensboro, NC. Three counts of 2nd degree murder by vehicle. A sad day indeed to the Music, Show, and Nascar industry. May all RIP.> >Kimberly Hedrick >type 1, since 1974, >at age 3.

Response:

Johnny Cash died today due to complications from diabetes which resulted in respiratory failure at the age of 71. RIP, I loved his music.

Response:

I think that one of his best songs, "Sunday Morning Coming Down" pretty well describes the feeling. Charlie  T-1  32 years

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Johnny Cash died today due to complications from diabetes which resulted in > respiratory failure at the age of 71. > RIP, I loved his music.

Response:

I love that song. I was reading in the paper this morning that he was released from the hospital and I told my husband, I don’t think Johnny’s long for this world. Never knew it would be that short though. I’ll miss him. — Cheri – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – >I think that one of his best songs, "Sunday Morning Coming Down" pretty well >describes the feeling. >Charlie  T-1  32 years

Response:

Question:

Hi All, I’ve been told by my diabetes clinic that I should eat a normal healthy diet like most "normal" people and that I should only eat 3 meals a day with a snack before bedtime. I’ve been told by many others that in order to avoid BG spikes, I should eat smaller portions every couple of hours? So say eat about 8am, 10am, 12noon, This sounds crazy! What is the right approach?  This is confusing me! Also I’ve been told that if I am going to have any fruit juice or fresh fruit, that I should eat it with my meal. I like to have a small glass 6oz. of Orange Juice in the morning with my breakfast, but I fear that this little bit of orange juice is making my BG spike approx. +5mmol (+100) Should I just avoid the glass of orange juice altogether? Any advice or comments would be appreciated. Sincerest Regards, Eddie Type 2

Response:

> Hi All, > I’ve been told by my diabetes clinic that I should eat a normal healthy diet > like most "normal" people and that I should only eat 3 meals a day with a > snack before bedtime. > I’ve been told by many others that in order to avoid BG spikes, I should eat > smaller portions every couple of hours? So say eat about 8am, 10am, 12noon, > This sounds crazy! > What is the right approach?  This is confusing me!

Alas, there is no one diet that works for all of us.  You need to find an approach that works for you.  As for the "normal" people, I know few who eat only 3 meals and a bedtime snack.  Most eat whatever they want throughout the day.  You won’t be able to do that. > Also I’ve been told that if I am going to have any fruit juice or fresh > fruit, that I should eat it with my meal.

That’s if you can eat it at all.  Juice is probably best avoided unless it’s tomato juice or Diet V-8 Splash.  Juice is low in fiber and high in carbs. Carbs are what raise our BG.  Fruit is better than juice because it has the fiber, but many of us find we can no longer eat it.  Use your meter.  Test frequently.  Test at one hour after eating and two hours after eating.  If you are going >140, then you are eating too many carbs. > I like to have a small glass 6oz. of Orange Juice in the morning with my > breakfast, but I fear that this little bit of orange juice is making my BG > spike approx. +5mmol (+100) > Should I just avoid the glass of orange juice altogether?

Yep.  Or save it for some time when your BG is low. > Any advice or comments would be appreciated.

The body is the most insulin resistant first thing in the morning.  Many of us find we must cut back on the carbs then.  You might try sugar free Tang for an orange flavor.  Or as I mentioned above, Diet V-8 Splash.  It has only 3 g of carb per 8 oz. — Type 2 http://users.bestweb.net/~jbove/

Response:

Eddie, what works for you is what is normal for you. I dont do the five or sick meals,  I do the three meals and dont eat but every four hours between breakfast and lunch and then five between lunch and dinner. I watch my carbs and portion control so that I dont have spikes. As to the orange juice,  For me it is almost impossible to have,  I only have about three ounces if I wake with under eighty which is very rare,   Can you mix two ounces with water,  The orange juice is definitely raising your numbers. Dont forget to test test test test and more test. Loretta — In tribute to the United States of America and the State of Israel, two bastions of strength in a world filled with strife and terrorism.

Response:

> Hi All, > I’ve been told by my diabetes clinic that I should eat a normal healthy diet > like most "normal" people and that I should only eat 3 meals a day with a > snack before bedtime. > I’ve been told by many others that in order to avoid BG spikes, I should eat > smaller portions every couple of hours? So say eat about 8am, 10am, 12noon, > This sounds crazy! > What is the right approach?  This is confusing me!

        Yes, it is confusing.   There are basically two approaches to the diabetic diet.   Both approaches agree on one thing:  eating carbs raises your blood glucose levels (bgs).   After that they part ways.         Most doctors and dietitians follow the lead of the American Diabetes Assoc and the Canadian Diabetes Assoc and recommend a relatively high carb approach.  They say, eat like a person who is not diabetic.  Follow the Food Pyramid for a balanced diet, and eat plenty of carbs and minimize proteins and fats.   The reason is straight forward. Diabetics are prone to heart disease and kidney disease.   Low fat diets are recommended for heart disease and since protein is known to damage already damaged kidneys, they recommend low protein diets.  If you eat low-protien and low-fat, then high carb is all that’s left.  So that’s what they recommend.   A consequence of this dietary approach is that you need to compensate for the high carb diet by taking more medication and/or get more exercise to lower your BGs.         The other approach is low carb.  Richard K. Bernstein, MD is the diabetic low-carb guru.   He says eat low carb to prevent raising your bgs in the first place.   He goes on to say that, while there is research that shows damaged kidneys are harmed by protein, there is no research which shows healthy kidneys are damaged by protein, so he’s not afraid of eating protein.   As for fat, he feels maintaining low BGS is the best protection against heart disease for a diabetic.  And frankly, there have been a number of articles lately which question the research concerning dietary fat and heart disease.  He likes minimizing the amount of medications you need to take and to prevent raising your bgs in the first place.   If you eat low-carb, you can actually eat quite a bit without much worry of spiking a bg.         Most people choose one approach or the other.   (I’m sort of a low-carb kind of guy, myself.)  Now if you’re following the ADA/CDA approach, then you can see you’re always dealing with the problem that you’re eating foods that raise you bgs.   If you’re going to do that, it makes sense to spread your foods out over the day so your limited pancreas has a better chance of handling the load.   Imagine eating all your food in one meal once a day.   THis would be a big glycemic load for your pancreas.   If you eat two meals instead, then you’d cut the glycemic load in half.  The more meals you eat, the smaller each meal’s load becomes.  That’s why some people recommend eating many meals through the day.         Which is the best approach?  That a personal decision each of us has to make for ourselves.   Let your meter be your guide.  You have be aware of the choices and choose those that best fit into your lifestyle and preferences while are best at lowering your over all bgs.   Eat.  Test.   If you’re too high, then make changes to lower your bgs. > Also I’ve been told that if I am going to have any fruit juice or fresh > fruit, that I should eat it with my meal.

        Mixing carbs with fats and proteins tends to slow the absorption of the carbs.  This means the carbs enter your blood stream as glucose more slowly and helps keep your BGs lower.   So consuming high carb foods like fruit juice should be combined with other foods to slow absorption.    Or:  if you want to follow the low carb approach, few of us drink much fruit juice or eat much fruit.  Too much sugar in them.  Very high carb foods. > I like to have a small glass 6oz. of Orange Juice in the morning with my > breakfast, but I fear that this little bit of orange juice is making my BG > spike approx. +5mmol (+100)

        Yes, there’s a good chance it is.   Don’t forget the ADA/CDA approach requires you to take more medicine to bring down your bgs.   If you consume high carb foods like orange juice, you have to deal with it somehow.         A lot of people post on these list/newsgroups that they can’t follow the high carb approach because it makes them go too high.   Part of what they’re saying is that they really don’t want to take more medicine than they do.  There is also an ironic problem in that doctors are often reluctant to prescribe enough.  THey recommend this high carb diet but then tell their patients to control their bgs with diet and exercise, because they like to minimize medications as well. > Should I just avoid the glass of orange juice altogether?

        Many of us do.  I haven’t had orange juice in 9 years.  I kind of miss it, I guess.  But mostly I just think of it as a glass of sugar water and I don’t find that very tempting.         Whichever approach you feel is best for you, be sure to test after meals.  This will teach you which foods spike you.  With that information you can decide how to handle that to achieve better control.                         E

Response:

This post not CC’d by email >Hi All, >I’ve been told by my diabetes clinic that I should eat a normal healthy diet >like most "normal" people and that I should only eat 3 meals a day with a >snack before bedtime. >I’ve been told by many others that in order to avoid BG spikes, I should eat >smaller portions every couple of hours? So say eat about 8am, 10am, 12noon, >This sounds crazy! >What is the right approach?  

G’day G’day Eddie,   Alas the truth isn’t singular. It is more like the truths … except that sounds weird. I’d start with advice given by the diabetes clinic while giving some thought to what a normal healthy diet might be.  The brain sometimes doesn’t weird things like hearing "Eat what you normally eat."  I’m betting that is not what they intended.  The one thing most everyone is going to agree on is avoiding large portions. I also am almost willing to bet ‘like most "normal" people’ doesn’t mean a steady stream of take aways with 40% of calories from fat even if that is normal for a lot of people. >This is confusing me!

Confusion is but an early stage of learning … a useful signal to sort things out. >Also I’ve been told that if I am going to have any fruit juice or fresh >fruit, that I should eat it with my meal. >I like to have a small glass 6oz. of Orange Juice in the morning with my >breakfast, but I fear that this little bit of orange juice is making my BG >spike approx. +5mmol (+100)

5.0 mmol =  90 mg/dl So 5.5 mmol = 100 mg/dL (approx) Now is that hit on your system OK?   Is it going to be OK to keep doing it … that is the question. I’m betting you aren’t in the least bit confused about this one and have already answered the question.  That doesn’t mean to say you have to like the answer.   Life’s a bitch and when you gotta change you gotta change even if you might not want to.  Orange juice tends to be very concentrated. I takes a lot of oranges to make a glass of orange juice.  More than you would comfortably eat, so juice slides one by your senses devoted to self preservation. It might seem culturally insensitive to suggest it but one can EAT oranges or mandarins.  People do … they really do.   If you eat half an orange or a mandarin what effect does that have on your blood glucose?  I don’t know the answer but it is in your interests to find out.   >Should I just avoid the glass of orange juice altogether?

It’s you eyesight, your kidneys, your … guess you’ve figured who has to answer that question. >Any advice or comments would be appreciated. >Sincerest Regards, >Eddie >Type 2

Eddie, I’d go for four meals a day.  The one before going to bed is of necessity a snack but that one is important because it prevents dawn phenomenon. Best wishes, — Quentin Grady       ^  ^  / New Zealand,       >#,#< [                     / /     "… and the blind dog was leading." http://homepages.paradise.net.nz/quentin

Response:

There are a number of truths. My truth, your truth and all the other folks here have truths. You need to learn about YOUR body and how it gets along with this disease.  If you look at this as a science experiment, you’ll discover your truth. Here’s the advice I give all those seeking their personal diabetic truth: There is so much to absorb… you don’t have to rush into anything.  Begin by using your best weapon in this war, your meter.   You won’t keel over today, you have time to experiment, test, learn, test and figure out just how your body and this disease are getting along.  The most important thing you can do to learn about yourself and diabetes is test test  test. The single biggest question a diabetic has to answer is: What do I eat? Unfortunately, the answer is pretty confusing. What confounds us all is the fact that different diabetics can get great results on wildly different food plans.  Some of us here achieve great blood glucose control eating a high complex carbohydrate diet. Others find that anything over 75 – 100g of carbs a day is too much.  Still others are somewhere in between. At the beginning all of us felt frustrated.  We wanted to be handed THE way to eat, to ensure our continued health.  But we all learned that there is no one way.  Each of us had to find our own path, using the experience of those that went before, but still having to discover for ourselves how OUR bodies and this disease were coexisting. Ask questions, but remember each of us discovered on our own what works best for us.  You can use our experiences as jumping off points, but eventually you’ll work up a successful plan that is yours alone. What you are looking to discover is how different foods affect you.  As I’m sure you’ve read, carbohydrates (sugars, wheat, rice… the things our Grandmas called "starches") raise blood sugars the most rapidly.  Protein and fat do raise them, but not as high and much more slowly… so if you’re a T2, generally the insulin your body still makes may take care of the rise. You might want to try some  experiments. First:  Eat whatever you’ve been currently eating… but write it all down. Test yourself at the following times: Upon waking (fasting) 1 hour after each meal 2 hours after each meal At bedtime That means 8 x each day.  What you will discover by this is how long after a meal your highest reading comes… and how fast you return to "normal".  Also, you may see that a meal that included bread, fruit or other carbs gives you a higher reading. Then for the next few days, try to curb your carbs.  Eliminate breads, cereals, rices, beans, any wheat products, potato, corn, fruit… get all your carbs from veggies.  Test at the same schedule above. If you try this for a few days, you may find some pretty damn good readings.  It’s worth a few days to discover. Eventually you can slowly add back carbs until you see them affecting your meter. The thing about this disease… though we share much in common and we need to follow certain guidelines… in the end, each of our bodies dictate our treatment and our success. The closer we get to non-diabetic numbers, the greater chance we have of avoiding horrible complications.  The key here is AIM… I know that everyone is at a different point in their disease… and it is progressive. But, if we aim for the best numbers and do our best, we give ourselves the best shot at heath we’ve got. That’s all we can do. Here’s my opinion on what numbers to aim for, they are non-diabetic numbers. FBG                         under 110 One hour after meals       under 140 Two hours after meals     under 120 or for those in the mmol parts of the world: Fasting                              Under 6 One hour after meals         Under 8 Two hours after meals       Under 6.5 Recent studies have indicated that the most important numbers are your "after meal" numbers. They may be the most indicative of future complications, especially heart problems. Listen to your doctor, but you are the leader of your diabetic care team.  While his /her advice is learned, it is not absolute.   You will end up knowing much more about your body and how it’s handling diabetes than your doctor will.   Your meter is your best weapon. Just remember, we’re not in a race or a competition with anyone but ourselves… Play around with your food plan… TEST TEST TEST.  Learn what foods cause spikes, what foods cause cravings… Use your body as a science experiment. You’ll read about a lot of different ways people use to control their diabetes… Many are diametrically opposed. After awhile you’ll learn that there is no one size fits all around here.  Take some time to experiment and you’ll soon discover the plan that works for you. Best of luck! Jennifer – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – > Hi All, > I’ve been told by my diabetes clinic that I should eat a normal healthy diet > like most "normal" people and that I should only eat 3 meals a day with a > snack before bedtime. > I’ve been told by many others that in order to avoid BG spikes, I should eat > smaller portions every couple of hours? So say eat about 8am, 10am, 12noon, > This sounds crazy! > What is the right approach?  This is confusing me! > Also I’ve been told that if I am going to have any fruit juice or fresh > fruit, that I should eat it with my meal. > I like to have a small glass 6oz. of Orange Juice in the morning with my > breakfast, but I fear that this little bit of orange juice is making my BG > spike approx. +5mmol (+100) > Should I just avoid the glass of orange juice altogether? > Any advice or comments would be appreciated. > Sincerest Regards, > Eddie > Type 2

Response:

Jennifer!  Thank you so much for that insightful reply to my posting.  I have been doing the testing exactly as you mentioned for the last 2 days and I feel like I am heading in the right direction.  Reading your reply has just given me a tremendous moral boost and I sincerely appreciate you taking the time to respond. Sincerest Regards, Eddie Type 2

There are a number of truths. My truth, your truth and all the other folks here have truths. You need to learn about YOUR body and how it gets along with this disease.  If you look at this as a science experiment, you’ll discover your truth. Here’s the advice I give all those seeking their personal diabetic truth: There is so much to absorb… you don’t have to rush into anything.  Begin by using your best weapon in this war, your meter.   You won’t keel over today, you have time to experiment, test, learn, test and figure out just how your body and this disease are getting along.  The most important thing you can do to learn about yourself and diabetes is test test  test. The single biggest question a diabetic has to answer is: What do I eat? Unfortunately, the answer is pretty confusing. What confounds us all is the fact that different diabetics can get great results on wildly different food plans.  Some of us here achieve great blood glucose control eating a high complex carbohydrate diet. Others find that anything over 75 – 100g of carbs a day is too much.  Still others are somewhere in between. At the beginning all of us felt frustrated.  We wanted to be handed THE way to eat, to ensure our continued health.  But we all learned that there is no one way.  Each of us had to find our own path, using the experience of those that went before, but still having to discover for ourselves how OUR bodies and this disease were coexisting. Ask questions, but remember each of us discovered on our own what works best for us.  You can use our experiences as jumping off points, but eventually you’ll work up a successful plan that is yours alone. What you are looking to discover is how different foods affect you.  As I’m sure you’ve read, carbohydrates (sugars, wheat, rice… the things our Grandmas called "starches") raise blood sugars the most rapidly.  Protein and fat do raise them, but not as high and much more slowly… so if you’re a T2, generally the insulin your body still makes may take care of the rise. You might want to try some  experiments. First:  Eat whatever you’ve been currently eating… but write it all down. Test yourself at the following times: Upon waking (fasting) 1 hour after each meal 2 hours after each meal At bedtime That means 8 x each day.  What you will discover by this is how long after a meal your highest reading comes… and how fast you return to "normal".  Also, you may see that a meal that included bread, fruit or other carbs gives you a higher reading. Then for the next few days, try to curb your carbs.  Eliminate breads, cereals, rices, beans, any wheat products, potato, corn, fruit… get all your carbs from veggies.  Test at the same schedule above. If you try this for a few days, you may find some pretty damn good readings.  It’s worth a few days to discover. Eventually you can slowly add back carbs until you see them affecting your meter. The thing about this disease… though we share much in common and we need to follow certain guidelines… in the end, each of our bodies dictate our treatment and our success. The closer we get to non-diabetic numbers, the greater chance we have of avoiding horrible complications.  The key here is AIM… I know that everyone is at a different point in their disease… and it is progressive. But, if we aim for the best numbers and do our best, we give ourselves the best shot at heath we’ve got. That’s all we can do. Here’s my opinion on what numbers to aim for, they are non-diabetic numbers. FBG                        under 110 One hour after meals       under 140 Two hours after meals     under 120 or for those in the mmol parts of the world: Fasting                              Under 6 One hour after meals         Under 8 Two hours after meals       Under 6.5 Recent studies have indicated that the most important numbers are your "after meal" numbers. They may be the most indicative of future complications, especially heart problems. Listen to your doctor, but you are the leader of your diabetic care team.  While his /her advice is learned, it is not absolute.   You will end up knowing much more about your body and how it’s handling diabetes than your doctor will.   Your meter is your best weapon. Just remember, we’re not in a race or a competition with anyone but ourselves… Play around with your food plan… TEST TEST TEST.  Learn what foods cause spikes, what foods cause cravings… Use your body as a science experiment. You’ll read about a lot of different ways people use to control their diabetes… Many are diametrically opposed. After awhile you’ll learn that there is no one size fits all around here.  Take some time to experiment and you’ll soon discover the plan that works for you. Best of luck! Jennifer – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – > Hi All, > I’ve been told by my diabetes clinic that I should eat a normal healthy diet > like most "normal" people and that I should only eat 3 meals a day with a > snack before bedtime. > I’ve been told by many others that in order to avoid BG spikes, I should eat > smaller portions every couple of hours? So say eat about 8am, 10am, 12noon, > This sounds crazy! > What is the right approach?  This is confusing me! > Also I’ve been told that if I am going to have any fruit juice or fresh > fruit, that I should eat it with my meal. > I like to have a small glass 6oz. of Orange Juice in the morning with my > breakfast, but I fear that this little bit of orange juice is making my BG > spike approx. +5mmol (+100) > Should I just avoid the glass of orange juice altogether? > Any advice or comments would be appreciated. > Sincerest Regards, > Eddie > Type 2

Response:

really appreciate your advice and comments. Eddie Type 2

Hi All, I’ve been told by my diabetes clinic that I should eat a normal healthy diet like most "normal" people and that I should only eat 3 meals a day with a snack before bedtime. I’ve been told by many others that in order to avoid BG spikes, I should eat smaller portions every couple of hours? So say eat about 8am, 10am, 12noon, This sounds crazy! What is the right approach?  This is confusing me! Also I’ve been told that if I am going to have any fruit juice or fresh fruit, that I should eat it with my meal. I like to have a small glass 6oz. of Orange Juice in the morning with my breakfast, but I fear that this little bit of orange juice is making my BG spike approx. +5mmol (+100) Should I just avoid the glass of orange juice altogether? Any advice or comments would be appreciated. Sincerest Regards, Eddie Type 2

Response:

Eddie, Sorry I didn’t respond earlier.  Welcome to the group.  Jennifer’s advice is golden.  Follow it and things will get better. c

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Hi All, > I’ve been told by my diabetes clinic that I should eat a normal healthy diet > like most "normal" people and that I should only eat 3 meals a day with a > snack before bedtime. > I’ve been told by many others that in order to avoid BG spikes, I should eat > smaller portions every couple of hours? So say eat about 8am, 10am, 12noon, > This sounds crazy! > What is the right approach?  This is confusing me! > Also I’ve been told that if I am going to have any fruit juice or fresh > fruit, that I should eat it with my meal. > I like to have a small glass 6oz. of Orange Juice in the morning with my > breakfast, but I fear that this little bit of orange juice is making my BG > spike approx. +5mmol (+100) > Should I just avoid the glass of orange juice altogether? > Any advice or comments would be appreciated. > Sincerest Regards, > Eddie > Type 2

Response:

> Jennifer!  Thank you so much for that insightful reply to my posting.  I > have been doing the testing exactly as you mentioned for the last 2 days and > I feel like I am heading in the right direction.  Reading your reply has > just given me a tremendous moral boost and I sincerely appreciate you > taking the time to respond. > Sincerest Regards, > Eddie > Type 2

You’re more than welcome Eddie. I so remember the first days after diagnosis.  I was angry and quite afraid that I would never get a handle on things. But I did.  And so did most everyone here. And I promise, eventually life continues back to almost normal.  Being a diabetic won’t define you. Hang in. Jennifer

Response:

Jennifer scribbled these tid bits > And I promise, eventually life continues back to almost normal.  Being a > diabetic won’t define you. > Hang in. > Jennifer

Jennifer you are an angel. We all want to be supportive but day in and day out you are the real thing. I thank you so much for being here and giving of what you have for the folks here. —     "If the Lord can see his way clear to bless the Republican Party the way it’s been carrying on, then the rest of us ought to get it without even asking."  - Will Rogers  http://www.livejournal.com/users/ronnie_in_dc

Response:

Ronnie… No fair! You made me tear up. And I’m glad you’re here, defending the honor of the group day in and day out! xoxox Jennifer – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – > Jennifer scribbled these tid bits >And I promise, eventually life continues back to almost normal.  Being a >diabetic won’t define you. >Hang in. >Jennifer > Jennifer you are an angel. We all want to be supportive but day in and day > out you are the real thing. I thank you so much for being here and giving > of what you have for the folks here.

Response:

> Hi All, > I’ve been told by my diabetes clinic that I should eat a normal healthy diet > like most "normal" people and that I should only eat 3 meals a day with a > snack before bedtime. > I’ve been told by many others that in order to avoid BG spikes, I should eat > smaller portions every couple of hours? So say eat about 8am, 10am, 12noon, > This sounds crazy!

There is no one right or wrong way but, IMO, eat 3 squares a day. Eating at short, regular intervals may not cause large spikes but may keep your BG at a higher average level. Eating 3 times a day will more than likely keep your overall BG lower. You will likely spike after a meal…that’s almost unavoidable…non diabetics spike after a meal…it’s completely normal. Your goal should be to keep the spike in a target range below a certain level…that level should be determined by you and your doctor. Your diet will have a large impact on pp levels, these levels can be managed with a combination of meds and exercise. Only you and your doctor can determine how you should manage your DM.

Response:

Hi Colleen, Thanks for taking the time to respond to my post. I really appreciate the support from every body so far. I have so many questions….. Only 3 days in this group and I am feeling more positive as each day passes. Thanks, Eddie Type 2

Eddie, Sorry I didn’t respond earlier.  Welcome to the group.  Jennifer’s advice is golden.  Follow it and things will get better. c

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Hi All, > I’ve been told by my diabetes clinic that I should eat a normal healthy diet > like most "normal" people and that I should only eat 3 meals a day with a > snack before bedtime. > I’ve been told by many others that in order to avoid BG spikes, I should eat > smaller portions every couple of hours? So say eat about 8am, 10am, 12noon, > This sounds crazy! > What is the right approach?  This is confusing me! > Also I’ve been told that if I am going to have any fruit juice or fresh > fruit, that I should eat it with my meal. > I like to have a small glass 6oz. of Orange Juice in the morning with my > breakfast, but I fear that this little bit of orange juice is making my BG > spike approx. +5mmol (+100) > Should I just avoid the glass of orange juice altogether? > Any advice or comments would be appreciated. > Sincerest Regards, > Eddie > Type 2

Response:

: Hi Colleen, : Thanks for taking the time to respond to my post. : I really appreciate the support from every body so far. : I have so many questions….. : Only 3 days in this group and I am feeling more positive as each day passes. : Thanks, : Eddie : Type 2 Eddie, this group can really not only help yu get started, but help you to keep on the "straight and narrow" once yu have a workalbe plan and decent blood glucose numbers.  I find that I check i at least once a day just to keep myslf in line.   I know yu can succeed and will learn wht yu can and can’t eat adn will find tht you really like many of the "good for you " foods.  Just hang in there. Unfortunately, it doesn’t necessarily improve your typing:-) Wendy

Response:

Thanks again, Eddie Type 2

: Hi Colleen, : Thanks for taking the time to respond to my post. : I really appreciate the support from every body so far. : I have so many questions….. : Only 3 days in this group and I am feeling more positive as each day passes. : Thanks, : Eddie : Type 2 Eddie, this group can really not only help yu get started, but help you to keep on the "straight and narrow" once yu have a workalbe plan and decent blood glucose numbers.  I find that I check i at least once a day just to keep myslf in line. I know yu can succeed and will learn wht yu can and can’t eat adn will find tht you really like many of the "good for you " foods.  Just hang in there. Unfortunately, it doesn’t necessarily improve your typing:-) Wendy

Response:

Question:

> I believe that you are shilling for that idiot in New Jersey.

You’re not on your own there either. He is another ranting zealot, and you are a brain dead echo. Yep.. > Leave us alone. . .

Now that’s wishful thinking:-) Beav

Response:

15:53:43 Sun, 20 Jul 2003alt.support.diabetes >Thanks for the article Jai…. I read an article of this nature in a journal >just the other day. It described how milk harms the intestinal immune system >which is so commonly found in type 1 diabetics and that there is some kind >of virus which leads to the disease. >Jai aka Jay Stevens is a known troll

Also, I think the milk theory has been shown to be incorrect anyway, although I don’t have any specific references for that. — London, UK              Home Page:      http://www.tucana.demon.co.uk                          Web Shop:      http://buy.at/tucana           Mobile Phone Ring Tones:      http://www.ringamoby.com "Everything I do and say with anyone makes a difference." Gita Bellin

Response:

I believe that you are shilling for that idiot in New Jersey.  He is another ranting zealot, and you are a brain dead echo. Leave us alone. . . >You are welcome, Clive. The human infant needs mother’s >milk in the beginning, that’s all.  After that, the general >recommendation today is to drink soy milk, almond milk, rice >milk and other plant-based foods. >Jai Maharaj

Being liberal means not having to say you are sorry.

Response:

Cow’s milk vs. rice milk http://www.parentsplace.com/expert/nutritionist/qas/0,,166437_105115,…

Response:

> You are welcome, Clive. The human infant needs mother’s > milk in the beginning, that’s all.  After that, the general > recommendation today is to drink soy milk, almond milk, rice > milk and other plant-based foods.

The "general" recomendation? Don’t you mean your crackpot bastard veggitarian recommendation? Get real man, and anyway, if we didn’t drink their milk, we’d have to eat the cow so more corpse munching happens and you wouldn’t want THAT now would you?

Response:

http://www.mercola.com/article/soy/

Response:

> You are welcome, Clive. The human infant needs mother’s > milk in the beginning, that’s all.  After that, the general > recommendation today is to drink soy milk, almond milk, rice > milk and other plant-based foods.

Name all the people who have made that recommendation. Then name all the people who don’t recommend it, to support your contention that it is "the general recommendation". "Shedding some light on this problem, a UC Irvine-led study discovered that a mineral found in high levels in soy milk appears to be linked to behavioral problems. The study in rats, one of the first scientific inquiries into soy milk and ADHD, indicates that the mineral manganese may cause behavioral problems if consumed in high doses. The study appears in the August issue of NeuroToxicology." http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2002/10/021007071724.htm Got mangoes, jyotishit? GRILLED LAMB CHOPS WITH SPICY MANGO SAUCE This recipe can be prepared in 45 minutes or less. 1 mango 1 large shallot 1/4 cup fresh lime juice 1 teaspoon sugar, or to taste 1/8 teaspoon cayenne two 1/2-inch-thick center-cut shoulder lamb chops (about 3/4 pound each) Garnish: lime wedges and fresh cilantro sprigs Prepare grill. Peel, pit, and coarsely chop mango. Finely chop shallot. In a blender pur

Question:

Hi Viorel, Is not so easy and so correctly to be diagnosed as a T1 patient only in one week.How old are you? Is this the first diabetes onset ? Which      were the diagnosis basics? (BG,HbA1c,Lipid’s Profile – HDL,LDL VLDL,            CHOL,TGL,C-Reactive Protein,Urine Analysis,Autoantibodies et al.). euristics < < – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – > So, I was diagnosed type I one week ago (I stayed one week in hospital). > My BG is quite higher (a medium = 180), but it varies very much in the day. > My problem it is not the weight; I am very skinny. But guys, I am very > hungry (this was my problem all the time). I don’t know what to do. If I eat > my BG it blows; if I don’t eat I am hungry all the time. > If I understood correctly it is better to make the tests after meals? But I > must take the insulin before so that means I must do also a test before > eating. Right? > Thank you for your answers! > Viorel

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> My problem it is not the weight; I am very skinny. But guys, I am very > hungry (this was my problem all the time). I don’t know what to do. If I eat > my BG it blows; if I don’t eat I am hungry all the time. >    You need to eat until you satisfy your hunger, but you’ll need to > adjust your insulin dose so your bgs don’t get out of control. > If I understood correctly it is better to make the tests after meals? But I > must take the insulin before so that means I must do also a test before > eating. Right? >    Yes.  You’ll need to test before your meal, because your before-meal > reading will affect how much insulin you take.  And you need to test > after the meal to be sure you took the correct amount of insulin. >    Tell us which insulins are you using?  How has your doctor ordered your > doseage?   What patient education did your doctor arrange for you? >>You need to eat until you satisfy your hunger, but you’ll need to > adjust your insulin dose so your bgs don’t get out of control.>>>

I have been type 1 since 1939 and I get a false hunger when my bg goes above 150 for any length of time, so I would caution against eating until you satisfy your hunger. Work on getting your bg down and then see if you’re still hungry.

Response:

I have 34. Last 2 week I was very ill. I took varicella from my girl; and last week I called the emergency because I was very, very bad. I couldn’t breath and I had pain on the back; first they believed that I have pneumonia, but on the analysis my PH was 5.4 (like in "Aliens") and the BG was very high; also they found in my urine large amounts of ketones and sugar. So they gave me insulin and other stuff and I start recovered very quickly. They ask me if before this I was going often to the toilet = yes Drink a lot of water      = yes (4 l / day) Loose weight = yes; but not very much. They didn’t find anything else.

Response:

Viorel, welcome to the club that no one wanted to join, But we are here and we will try to answer all your questions,  I cant help with the insuin and testing question,  But, as to the food there is no reason you cannot eat,  Just dont eat carbs, especially starchy ones,  Protein, which is what gives you a full feeling is good to eat, moderation of course in everything,  Vegetables are a good choice,I dont know how many carbs you eat a day and what your dietician has told you,  Insulin users eat differently than those on diet and exercise and meds. Good luck stay and learn. Loretta — In tribute to the United States of America and the State of Israel, two bastions of strength in a world filled with strife and terrorism.

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – >So, I was diagnosed type I one week ago (I stayed one week in hospital). >My BG is quite higher (a medium = 180), but it varies very much in the day. >My problem it is not the weight; I am very skinny. But guys, I am very >hungry (this was my problem all the time). I don’t know what to do. If I eat >my BG it blows; if I don’t eat I am hungry all the time. >If I understood correctly it is better to make the tests after meals? But I >must take the insulin before so that means I must do also a test before >eating. Right? >Thank you for your answers! >Viorel

This is correct you must test fasting(upon waking before eating), before meals and two hours after meals and at bedtime.  Especially if you are injecting novolog or humalog to cover meals.   At first it feels like it’s a very big inconvenience but you do get used to it after a while and will start testing out of habit.   Do you have an endocrinologist? What insulins are you taking? Have you received any training from a diabetes educator and dietician? Mack Type 1 since 1975 http://www.alt-support-diabetes.org http://www.insulin-pumpers.org  In tribute to the United States of America and the State  of Israel, two bastions of strength in a world filled with strife and  terrorism.

Response:

Thay wrote that Novolin ge NPH Penfill last for about 24 hours.

Response:

>Thank you for yours answers! >I take 4 shoots of insulin mainly like this: >6 units in morning (NovoRapid – insulin aspart) >6 units about noon (NovoRapid – insulin aspart) >8 units in the evening (NovoRapid – insulin aspart) >14 before sleeping (Novolin ge NPH)

NPH only lasts about 12 hours.  NovoRapid is not designed to be used in the absence of a basal insulin.  I would get better advice on your insulin regime that what you have now. >At theses shoots I have to take correction if: ><= 4 ->  -2 units >4.1 – 10 ->  nothing (this it a normal level) >10.1 – 12 ->  +1 unit >12.1 – 15 ->  +2 units >=15.1  +3 units

a pretty basic chart.  Does your doctor know how to adjust this to your individual needs or does she/he think this chart will work for everyone the same way?   I would suggest going to the how to section at http://www.insulin-pumpers.org the information here applies to insulin injections and pumping in regards to the info on calculating bolus(meal injections) and making corrections.  It will show you how to calculate how much one unit of insulin will effect your BG and give you help in figuring out how much a specific amount of carbs will effect your BG. Mack Type 1 since 1975 http://www.alt-support-diabetes.org http://www.insulin-pumpers.org  In tribute to the United States of America and the State  of Israel, two bastions of strength in a world filled with strife and  terrorism. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->(for american system multiply by 18) >I use a One Touch InDuo meter.

Response:

> So, I was diagnosed type I one week ago (I stayed one week in hospital). > My BG is quite higher (a medium = 180), but it varies very much in the day. > My problem it is not the weight; I am very skinny. But guys, I am very > hungry (this was my problem all the time). I don’t know what to do. If I eat > my BG it blows; if I don’t eat I am hungry all the time. > If I understood correctly it is better to make the tests after meals? But I > must take the insulin before so that means I must do also a test before > eating. Right? > Thank you for your answers!

Many of us here are type 2.  What applies to us doesn’t necessarily apply to you.  Some type 2s test before eating, but most of us test after eating. You have no choice but to test before because you use insulin.  As far as the hunger goes, that could be because your BG is too high.  When it’s high, you are literally starving your cells and no amount of food will help because it isn’t getting into your cells.  Get your BG down to where it should be and you might find that your hunger lessens. I don’t use insulin, so I can’t help you there.  Could be you need to be using a different type, different combination or different amount.  If you could tell us what type you are using, how much and when, then perhaps someone else could be of more help with that. — Type 2 http://users.bestweb.net/~jbove/

Response:

>Thay wrote that Novolin ge NPH Penfill last for about 24 hours.

sorry but it’s 12 hours.  There may be some residual effect as it tapers off but it will not work properly as a basal for 24 hours with only one injection. Mack Type 1 since 1975 http://www.alt-support-diabetes.org http://www.insulin-pumpers.org  In tribute to the United States of America and the State  of Israel, two bastions of strength in a world filled with strife and  terrorism.

Response:

So, I was diagnosed type I one week ago (I stayed one week in hospital). My BG is quite higher (a medium = 180), but it varies very much in the day. My problem it is not the weight; I am very skinny. But guys, I am very hungry (this was my problem all the time). I don’t know what to do. If I eat my BG it blows; if I don’t eat I am hungry all the time. If I understood correctly it is better to make the tests after meals? But I must take the insulin before so that means I must do also a test before eating. Right? Thank you for your answers! Viorel

Response:

> My problem it is not the weight; I am very skinny. But guys, I am very > hungry (this was my problem all the time). I don’t know what to do. If I eat > my BG it blows; if I don’t eat I am hungry all the time.

        You need to eat until you satisfy your hunger, but you’ll need to adjust your insulin dose so your bgs don’t get out of control. > If I understood correctly it is better to make the tests after meals? But I > must take the insulin before so that means I must do also a test before > eating. Right?

        Yes.  You’ll need to test before your meal, because your before-meal reading will affect how much insulin you take.  And you need to test after the meal to be sure you took the correct amount of insulin.         Tell us which insulins are you using?  How has your doctor ordered your doseage?   What patient education did your doctor arrange for you? — E I know you believe you understand what you think I said. I’m just not sure you realize what you heard is not what I meant.

Response:

"viorel blanaru" wrote in part …  If I understood correctly it is better to make the tests after meals? But I must take the insulin before so that means I must do also a test before eating. Right?  Thank you for your answers! Viorel,  I am an oral meds D&E Type 2, so I will leave the insulin question to others.  However, I think all here will agree that the numbers after eating (1 hr, 2 hrs) give you more of an idea of where you are at with this disease, than at any other time. Arnie –

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->So, I was diagnosed type I one week ago (I stayed one week in hospital). >My BG is quite higher (a medium = 180), but it varies very much in the day. >My problem it is not the weight; I am very skinny. But guys, I am very >hungry (this was my problem all the time). I don’t know what to do. If I eat >my BG it blows; if I don’t eat I am hungry all the time. >If I understood correctly it is better to make the tests after meals? But I >must take the insulin before so that means I must do also a test before >eating. Right? >Thank you for your answers! >Viorel

        Once you learn how to manage your insulin shots, you will be able to eat and your bG will not "blow".   Once you learn how to manage your insulin shots, it will not "varies very much in the day". Your post sounds like you have not been taught the proper techniques yet. Tell us which insulins you use,  when you shoot, and how much.     We will respond with our opinions on proper technique. The insulin users training course at my hospital takes 9 hours in a classroom, spread over 3 days.    I hope that you have access to a proper training course.  If not,  we can tell you how we manage our insulin shots. Regards   Old Al

Response:

Thank you for yours answers! I take 4 shoots of insulin mainly like this: 6 units in morning (NovoRapid – insulin aspart) 6 units about noon (NovoRapid – insulin aspart) 8 units in the evening (NovoRapid – insulin aspart) 14 before sleeping (Novolin ge NPH) At theses shoots I have to take correction if: <= 4 ->  -2 units 4.1 – 10 ->  nothing (this it a normal level) 10.1 – 12 ->  +1 unit 12.1 – 15 ->  +2 units >=15.1  +3 units

(for american system multiply by 18) I use a One Touch InDuo meter.

Response:

Question:

Small like the Ultra, also gives results in 5 seconds. You can mark readings with insulin injections. 250 memory.This meter is in the flyer from Walgreens.Free with purchase of 100 test strips) BD Introduces New Systems to Make Diabetes Monitoring and Management Easier, Faster, and Less Painful FRANKLIN LAKES, NJ — (MARKET WIRE) — 01/08/2003 — To view video click here: www.onthescene.com/wm/bd.wmv BD (Becton, Dickinson and Company) (NYSE: BDX), the leading provider of insulin delivery systems, has announced today the U.S. availability of two new FDA-cleared blood glucose monitoring products designed to help improve diabetes management. The BD Logic? Blood Glucose Monitor and the BD Latitude? Diabetes Management System combine the thinnest lancets available with test strips that require a very small amount of blood and deliver accurate readings in a fast amount of time — only five seconds. No other device offers all of these features in one system. ?Diabetes remains one of the most prevalent health issues in America,? said Edward J. Ludwig, Chairman, President and Chief Executive Officer of BD. ?Of the 17 million Americans with diabetes, 11 million have been diagnosed with type 1 or type 2 diabetes, and approximately 6 million still remain undiagnosed. At BD, we are committed to developing products and systems such as the BD Logic? and BD Latitude? monitors that will help improve diabetes management and the quality of life for those who have this disease.? People with diabetes understand the unique challenges of monitoring blood glucose levels. For those who must monitor daily, or even several times a day, the process can be painful and time-consuming. However, accurately and consistently monitoring blood glucose levels is essential to managing the disease and can help prevent such complications as heart and kidney disease, blindness, stroke and amputations. In addition, the blood glucose monitors display current readings and have memory capacities of up to 250 blood glucose and 250 insulin records at one time, enabling people with diabetes to maintain accurate monitoring without significant interruption to busy and active lifestyles. ?These new monitoring devices can help ensure that ?peaks and valleys? are avoided, thus allowing people with diabetes and their doctors to monitor patterns most effectively and achieve compliance,? stated Dr. Goland. The BD Latitude Diabetes Management System is an all-in-one device that combines this new and efficient blood glucose monitor with an organizer that holds all the necessary supplies for testing and insulin injection. For more than five decades, BD has been the leader in the development of insulin delivery systems that help enhance injection comfort, making therapy easier and helping to improve lifestyles for people with diabetes. For more information about diabetes and its treatment, talk to your healthcare provider. To learn more about the BD Logic Blood Glucose Monitor and the BD Latitude Diabetes Management System, visit www.bddiabetes.com. Arnold T2,22years,10mg glyburide,HbA1c=5.9 My diet and weight loss web site: http://www.healthchecksystems.com/success.htm

Response:

Arnold, No other meter can compare with the Logic and Latitude meters. I use the Logic exclusively now that I have solved my insurance reimbursement problem. Some other meters are just as fast (5 seconds) and some take as little blood (0.3 microliters), but no other meter has both. Besides with these new meters you can get enough blood with BD’s new 33 gauge lancets. They are less painful–but are so fine that I can’t see them without my glasses! Even the software is first rate. It is the first program on the U.S. market to offer either serial or USB connection. Rick Mendosa: A Writer on the Web: www.mendosa.com Office: 238 Coronado Drive, Aptos, CA 95003-4011

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Small like the Ultra, also gives results in 5 seconds. You can mark > readings with insulin injections. 250 memory.This meter is in the flyer > from Walgreens.Free with purchase of 100 test strips) BD Introduces New > Systems to Make Diabetes Monitoring and Management Easier, Faster, and > Less Painful > FRANKLIN LAKES, NJ — (MARKET WIRE) — 01/08/2003 — To view video click > here: www.onthescene.com/wm/bd.wmv BD (Becton, Dickinson and Company) > (NYSE: BDX), the leading provider of insulin delivery systems, has > announced today the U.S. availability of two new FDA-cleared blood > glucose monitoring products designed to help improve diabetes > management. The BD Logic? Blood Glucose Monitor and the BD Latitude? > Diabetes Management System combine the thinnest lancets available with > test strips that require a very small amount of blood and deliver > accurate readings in a fast amount of time — only five seconds. No > other device offers all of these features in one system. ?Diabetes > remains one of the most prevalent health issues in America,? said Edward > J. Ludwig, Chairman, President and Chief Executive Officer of BD. ?Of > the 17 million Americans with diabetes, 11 million have been diagnosed > with type 1 or type 2 diabetes, and approximately 6 million still remain > undiagnosed. At BD, we are committed to developing products and systems > such as the BD Logic? and BD Latitude? monitors that will help improve > diabetes management and the quality of life for those who have this > disease.? > People with diabetes understand the unique challenges of monitoring > blood glucose levels. For those who must monitor daily, or even several > times a day, the process can be painful and time-consuming. However, > accurately and consistently monitoring blood glucose levels is essential > to managing the disease and can help prevent such complications as heart > and kidney disease, blindness, stroke and amputations. In addition, the > blood glucose monitors display current readings and have memory > capacities of up to 250 blood glucose and 250 insulin records at one > time, enabling people with diabetes to maintain accurate monitoring > without significant interruption to busy and active lifestyles. ?These > new monitoring devices can help ensure that ?peaks and valleys? are > avoided, thus allowing people with diabetes and their doctors to monitor > patterns most effectively and achieve compliance,? stated Dr. Goland. > The BD Latitude Diabetes Management System is an all-in-one device that > combines this new and efficient blood glucose monitor with an organizer > that holds all the necessary supplies for testing and insulin injection. > For more than five decades, BD has been the leader in the development of > insulin delivery systems that help enhance injection comfort, making > therapy easier and helping to improve lifestyles for people with > diabetes. > For more information about diabetes and its treatment, talk to your > healthcare provider. To learn more about the BD Logic Blood Glucose > Monitor and the BD Latitude Diabetes Management System, visit > www.bddiabetes.com. > Arnold > T2,22years,10mg glyburide,HbA1c=5.9 > My diet and weight loss web site: > http://www.healthchecksystems.com/success.htm

Response:

This is all fine and dandy. I don’t see anything about the meter’s accuracy. Accuracy is my main concern, as I have no problems with alleged painful finger sticks, and drawing the needed amount of blood. I also have the cable to hook up to my computer to get all the trends and graphs I need. Maybe the features of this meter are set up more for the insulin user. If, however, this meter is guaranteed more accurate, I would be interested. I don’t see anything regarding accuracy on the web page. Maybe it is somewhere in the fine print. If important information like accuracy, needs to be hidden, then I am immediately suspicious. Sleepy – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – >Arnold, >No other meter can compare with the Logic and Latitude meters. I use the >Logic exclusively now that I have solved my insurance reimbursement problem. >Some other meters are just as fast (5 seconds) and some take as little blood >(0.3 microliters), but no other meter has both. Besides with these new >meters you can get enough blood with BD’s new 33 gauge lancets. They are >less painful–but are so fine that I can’t see them without my glasses! >Even the software is first rate. It is the first program on the U.S. market >to offer either serial or USB connection. >Rick Mendosa: A Writer on the Web: www.mendosa.com >Office: 238 Coronado Drive, Aptos, CA 95003-4011 > Small like the Ultra, also gives results in 5 seconds. You can mark > readings with insulin injections. 250 memory.This meter is in the flyer > from Walgreens.Free with purchase of 100 test strips) BD Introduces New > Systems to Make Diabetes Monitoring and Management Easier, Faster, and > Less Painful > FRANKLIN LAKES, NJ — (MARKET WIRE) — 01/08/2003 — To view video click > here: www.onthescene.com/wm/bd.wmv BD (Becton, Dickinson and Company) > (NYSE: BDX), the leading provider of insulin delivery systems, has > announced today the U.S. availability of two new FDA-cleared blood > glucose monitoring products designed to help improve diabetes > management. The BD Logic? Blood Glucose Monitor and the BD Latitude? > Diabetes Management System combine the thinnest lancets available with > test strips that require a very small amount of blood and deliver > accurate readings in a fast amount of time — only five seconds. No > other device offers all of these features in one system. ?Diabetes > remains one of the most prevalent health issues in America,? said Edward > J. Ludwig, Chairman, President and Chief Executive Officer of BD. ?Of > the 17 million Americans with diabetes, 11 million have been diagnosed > with type 1 or type 2 diabetes, and approximately 6 million still remain > undiagnosed. At BD, we are committed to developing products and systems > such as the BD Logic? and BD Latitude? monitors that will help improve > diabetes management and the quality of life for those who have this > disease.? > People with diabetes understand the unique challenges of monitoring > blood glucose levels. For those who must monitor daily, or even several > times a day, the process can be painful and time-consuming. However, > accurately and consistently monitoring blood glucose levels is essential > to managing the disease and can help prevent such complications as heart > and kidney disease, blindness, stroke and amputations. In addition, the > blood glucose monitors display current readings and have memory > capacities of up to 250 blood glucose and 250 insulin records at one > time, enabling people with diabetes to maintain accurate monitoring > without significant interruption to busy and active lifestyles. ?These > new monitoring devices can help ensure that ?peaks and valleys? are > avoided, thus allowing people with diabetes and their doctors to monitor > patterns most effectively and achieve compliance,? stated Dr. Goland. > The BD Latitude Diabetes Management System is an all-in-one device that > combines this new and efficient blood glucose monitor with an organizer > that holds all the necessary supplies for testing and insulin injection. > For more than five decades, BD has been the leader in the development of > insulin delivery systems that help enhance injection comfort, making > therapy easier and helping to improve lifestyles for people with > diabetes. > For more information about diabetes and its treatment, talk to your > healthcare provider. To learn more about the BD Logic Blood Glucose > Monitor and the BD Latitude Diabetes Management System, visit > www.bddiabetes.com. > Arnold > T2,22years,10mg glyburide,HbA1c=5.9 > My diet and weight loss web site: > http://www.healthchecksystems.com/success.htm

"Thats All Folks" Mel Blanc’s Epitaph

Response:

Sleepy, None of the meters on the market today is very accurate. I have written several articles about this problem. See www.mendosa.com/accurate.htm , www.mendosa.com/fda.htm , and www.mendosa.com/diabetes_update_39.htm . My directory of all meters is at www.mendosa.com/meters.htm Rick Mendosa: A Writer on the Web: www.mendosa.com Office: 238 Coronado Drive, Aptos, CA 95003-4011

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> This is all fine and dandy. I don’t see anything about the meter’s > accuracy. Accuracy is my main concern, as I have no problems with > alleged painful finger sticks, and drawing the needed amount of blood. > I also have the cable to hook up to my computer to get all the trends > and graphs I need. Maybe the features of this meter are set up more > for the insulin user. If, however, this meter is guaranteed more > accurate, I would be interested. I don’t see anything regarding > accuracy on the web page. Maybe it is somewhere in the fine print. If > important information like accuracy, needs to be hidden, then I am > immediately suspicious. > Sleepy >Arnold, >No other meter can compare with the Logic and Latitude meters. I use the >Logic exclusively now that I have solved my insurance reimbursement problem. >Some other meters are just as fast (5 seconds) and some take as little blood >(0.3 microliters), but no other meter has both. Besides with these new >meters you can get enough blood with BD’s new 33 gauge lancets. They are >less painful–but are so fine that I can’t see them without my glasses! >Even the software is first rate. It is the first program on the U.S. market >to offer either serial or USB connection. >Rick Mendosa: A Writer on the Web: www.mendosa.com >Office: 238 Coronado Drive, Aptos, CA 95003-4011 >> Small like the Ultra, also gives results in 5 seconds. You can mark >> readings with insulin injections. 250 memory.This meter is in the flyer >> from Walgreens.Free with purchase of 100 test strips) BD Introduces New >> Systems to Make Diabetes Monitoring and Management Easier, Faster, and >> Less Painful >> FRANKLIN LAKES, NJ — (MARKET WIRE) — 01/08/2003 — To view video click >> here: www.onthescene.com/wm/bd.wmv BD (Becton, Dickinson and Company) >> (NYSE: BDX), the leading provider of insulin delivery systems, has >> announced today the U.S. availability of two new FDA-cleared blood >> glucose monitoring products designed to help improve diabetes >> management. The BD Logic? Blood Glucose Monitor and the BD Latitude? >> Diabetes Management System combine the thinnest lancets available with >> test strips that require a very small amount of blood and deliver >> accurate readings in a fast amount of time — only five seconds. No >> other device offers all of these features in one system. ?Diabetes >> remains one of the most prevalent health issues in America,? said Edward >> J. Ludwig, Chairman, President and Chief Executive Officer of BD. ?Of >> the 17 million Americans with diabetes, 11 million have been diagnosed >> with type 1 or type 2 diabetes, and approximately 6 million still remain >> undiagnosed. At BD, we are committed to developing products and systems >> such as the BD Logic? and BD Latitude? monitors that will help improve >> diabetes management and the quality of life for those who have this >> disease.? >> People with diabetes understand the unique challenges of monitoring >> blood glucose levels. For those who must monitor daily, or even several >> times a day, the process can be painful and time-consuming. However, >> accurately and consistently monitoring blood glucose levels is essential >> to managing the disease and can help prevent such complications as heart >> and kidney disease, blindness, stroke and amputations. In addition, the >> blood glucose monitors display current readings and have memory >> capacities of up to 250 blood glucose and 250 insulin records at one >> time, enabling people with diabetes to maintain accurate monitoring >> without significant interruption to busy and active lifestyles. ?These >> new monitoring devices can help ensure that ?peaks and valleys? are >> avoided, thus allowing people with diabetes and their doctors to monitor >> patterns most effectively and achieve compliance,? stated Dr. Goland. >> The BD Latitude Diabetes Management System is an all-in-one device that >> combines this new and efficient blood glucose monitor with an organizer >> that holds all the necessary supplies for testing and insulin injection. >> For more than five decades, BD has been the leader in the development of >> insulin delivery systems that help enhance injection comfort, making >> therapy easier and helping to improve lifestyles for people with >> diabetes. >> For more information about diabetes and its treatment, talk to your >> healthcare provider. To learn more about the BD Logic Blood Glucose >> Monitor and the BD Latitude Diabetes Management System, visit >> www.bddiabetes.com. >> Arnold >> T2,22years,10mg glyburide,HbA1c=5.9 >> My diet and weight loss web site: >> http://www.healthchecksystems.com/success.htm > "Thats All Folks" > Mel Blanc’s Epitaph

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>You and your web site are quite popular and a good point of reference. >Have you ever thought about organizing a massive letter writing >campaign to the FDA.  The intent would be to have the FDA to tighten >the meter variance from 20% to maybe 5%.  I can see no logical reason >for such loose tolerances. >Lifescan and Roche are making mind boggling profits off producing low >quality products.  The more accurate the meter, the less the >complications, and the longer I live.

Considering the variables that can and do affect the way we test now, what makes you think that it is even possible to make a more accurate meter, that is affordable, and as easy to use as what we use now? I know I cannot afford $600.00 for a meter that costs $1 for each test strip, and on top of that, the strips must be refrigerated. Supposedly the company that makes the $600.00 meter is going to introduce a meter to the US market that will be more accurate, and more reasonably priced. I hope it does, as that will prove that the technology is available at a reasonable price, and will force the other meter companies to get off their butts, and compete. One other thing. If you bought your meter thinking it was a precise medical instrument, (for as little as $8) sorry , this is just *not* the case. What you bought was a relatively low tech plastic instrument, that given the numbers of environmental, and medication variances, does a pretty good job assuming that you test correctly. When I check my meter against my blood test when I have my quarterly reading, it is invariably within a few points. The 20% variance is not written in stone. It is a CYA number. Do I wish that strips were cheaper, and meters were guaranteed more accurate? Of course I do. However we all have to use the tools we are given, and our meters are just that, tools, and not precise medical instruments. Sleepy I don

Question:

Hi Guys and Gals, I was diagnosed last Wednesday with type II. The call came from the nurse. I see the doc tomorrow. I already have quite a list of questions for him. I’m sure he will want to put me on an oral med. What exactly do these oral meds do? I have already started dieting and exercising. I’m troubled about not being able to include potatoes and pasta, they have always been my diet base foods. I am an avid cyclist who for many of life’s reasons has kept me away from training/riding/racing/running for long enough for diabetes to rear it’s ugly head. My question is, what am I to drink on a one hundred mile bike ride if not Gatorade? The energy has to come from somewhere! Any help will be appreciated. ironbyron in Owensboro, KY

Response:

> Hi Guys and Gals, > I was diagnosed last Wednesday with type II. The call came from the nurse. I > see the doc tomorrow. I already have quite a list of questions for him. > I’m sure he will want to put me on an oral med. What exactly do these oral > meds do? I have already started dieting and exercising. I’m troubled about > not being able to include potatoes and pasta, they have always been my diet > base foods.

Potatoes and pasta shouldn’t be a problem if you are not carb sensitive but it may be wise to have them as part of a meal rather than basing the meal itself on those foods.  As you are a cyclist you should be able to tolerate a fair amount of carbs but a meter will help you decide this. Don’t be so sure about the meds though, not everyone is put on meds stragiht away, it’s possible to reduce your bg’s without them.  It’s possible to include your favourite foods too but just not in the amounts that you were used to. As to gatordade, that may not make a difference to your bg’s during a long ride, unless it is the final swig at the end.  You will know that when you test after a ride anyway.  Preventing muscle meltdown would have to be high on your list.

Response:

Wow sure wish Alien_Dancer was here. She could tell you something to drink. She does rollerblading and she knows alot about this. I sure miss her. But others will know too but she was the one who came to mind. Sorry I can’t help but maybe if you eat something high in carbs before your trip maybe water will do for the drink. JMO. Welcome to our group. I hope you stay and enjoy. Di — ~~~Love unconditionally and freely~~~ Only then will your heart learn what love is~~~ http://sweetblood.org/ http://www.diabeticnet.com/home.htm Return Email Disabled : Hi Guys and Gals, : I was diagnosed last Wednesday with type II. The call came from the nurse. I : see the doc tomorrow. I already have quite a list of questions for him. : I’m sure he will want to put me on an oral med. What exactly do these oral : meds do? I have already started dieting and exercising. I’m troubled about : not being able to include potatoes and pasta, they have always been my diet : base foods. : I am an avid cyclist who for many of life’s reasons has kept me away from : training/riding/racing/running for long enough for diabetes to rear it’s : ugly head. My question is, what am I to drink on a one hundred mile bike : ride if not Gatorade? The energy has to come from somewhere! : Any help will be appreciated. : : ironbyron in Owensboro, KY : :

Response:

> Wow sure wish Alien_Dancer was here. She could tell you something to > drink. She does rollerblading and she knows alot about this. I sure > miss her. But others will know too but she was the one who came to > mind. Sorry I can’t help but maybe if you eat something high in carbs > before your trip maybe water will do for the drink. JMO. Welcome to > our group. I hope you stay and enjoy.

Actually I was just thinking the same thing Di. Elvis, Alien is a grandmother who is into rollerblading and higher carb than most of us. Hope she sees your post.

Response:

> Hi Guys and Gals, > I was diagnosed last Wednesday with type II. The call came from the nurse. I > see the doc tomorrow. I already have quite a list of questions for him. > I’m sure he will want to put me on an oral med. What exactly do these oral > meds do?

There are different types of oral meds.  I am not really up on what they do other than to help your body use insulin more productively.  I am sure someone else can give you a much better explaination than that. I have already started dieting and exercising. That’s good!  But, keep in mind that you need to see a dietician.  And the diet he or she will give you might not be quite what you were expecting. Some people have weight loss as a goal.  Others do not.  You need to have a diet that takes into account what your goals are, your activity level and your food likes and dislikes. > I’m troubled about > not being able to include potatoes and pasta, they have always been my diet > base foods.

I don’t know where you got that information from, but it simply is not true! I am a vegetarian and eat potatoes and pasta several times a week.  I also eat lots of beans, popcorn and bread!  I DID have to learn to re-organize my diet though and change the way I ate things.  For example, a favorite meal of mine used to be pasta and kidney beans (or corn) tossed with some tomato sauce and Parmesan cheese.  I CAN still eat that, but I have to eat less of it and also add some non-starchy vegetables to my meal.  I might also  have eaten a meal consiting of nothing more than  mashed potatoes, peas, and corn…although not mixed together.  Again, I can eat those things, but must carefully measure my portions and add some protein and non-startchy vegetables.  I also had to learn to increase the amount of fat I was eating at some meals.  I know that sounds rather comical, but indeed it is true. If I didn’t feel like cooking, I might simply eat a package of fat-free Ramen or pop open a can of vegetables. They key is to eat a balanced diet and not to consume too many carbs at one time. > I am an avid cyclist who for many of life’s reasons has kept me away from > training/riding/racing/running for long enough for diabetes to rear it’s > ugly head. My question is, what am I to drink on a one hundred mile bike > ride if not Gatorade? The energy has to come from somewhere!

You *might* be able to drink Gatorade.  I am not a big fan of it and don’t know the nutritional value of it.  But I do know that if you exercise regularly…particularly strenuous exercise, you need more calories….especially from carbs.  Gatorade is probably not very filling and the nutritionist might suggest something else…like an orange that would help to fill you up as well as providing carbs.  Or perhaps some sort of sports bar and some water.  There is probably nothing at all wrong with drinking Gatorade except that it really doesn’t do much in terms of filling you up, and diabetics should eat a diet that contains lots of fiber.  So eating whole fruit is better in those terms than fruit juice.  And Gatorade is probably similar in composition to fruit juice plus electrolytes. I myself do weight training.  And I have to time my workouts around my meals so I don’t get hypos.  It’s probably easier for me to grab a snack since I do my workouts at home.  You will need to find something that is portable though…and will probably have to carry extra with you just in case.  You will probably also need to take along your meter so you can test your blood before, after and possibly during exercise.  Be sure to tell the nutritionist of your activity level.  In my own case, I’ve really had to press the issue because the ones I saw treated exercise like something people only *said* they did. Good luck!  I know you are probably in shock right now, but it does get better.  And don’t put too much stock in what the low carbers say.  It might work for them, but it won’t work for all of us.  The key is to find something that works for you! — http://www.redshift.com/~juliebove/ > Any help will be appreciated.

– http://www.redshift.com/~juliebove/

Response:

There are several general kinds of pills: the kind that keeps your liver from dumping so much glucose into your blood the kind that tells your pancreas "make more insulin!" the kind that attacks insulin resistance the kind that block/slow breakdown of starches see  http://www.diabetes.org/ada/c30c.asp. As for athletics, there are web sites on the subject; there is even www.diabetes-exercise.org/  (won’t come up right now, don’t know why). There are many athletes, some very famous and lots only famous to their friends & family, who have dealt with diabetes (both types). http://www.diabetesnet.com/news/news062099.html has short profiles of a few recent ones (one won a swimming gold in Sydney). One of the "ask the expert" questions at http://www.lifescan.com/lsexpert/expansjul00.html is about long distance biking. Also see http://www.diabetes.org/mendosa/april15_99.asp for an interesting article. Good luck to you. bj > Hi Guys and Gals, > I was diagnosed last Wednesday with type II. The call came from the nurse. I > see the doc tomorrow. I already have quite a list of questions for him. > I’m sure he will want to put me on an oral med. What

exactly do these oral > meds do? I have already started dieting and exercising. I’m troubled about > not being able to include potatoes and pasta, they have always been my diet > base foods. > I am an avid cyclist who for many of life’s reasons has kept me away from > training/riding/racing/running for long enough for

diabetes to rear it’s – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> ugly head. My question is, what am I to drink on a one hundred mile bike > ride if not Gatorade? The energy has to come from somewhere! > Any help will be appreciated. > ironbyron in Owensboro, KY

Response:

>I was diagnosed last Wednesday with type II. The call came from the nurse. I >see the doc tomorrow. I already have quite a list of questions for him. >I’m sure he will want to put me on an oral med. What exactly do these oral >meds do? I have already started dieting and exercising. I’m troubled about >not being able to include potatoes and pasta, they have always been my diet >base foods. >I am an avid cyclist who for many of life’s reasons has kept me away from >training/riding/racing/running for long enough for diabetes to rear it’s >ugly head. . .[snip]. . . >ironbyron in Owensboro, KY

  Three points:  1.  The biggie!   Non-obese diabetics with a history of exercise (like for instance, me)  often are diagnosed as Type 2 diabetics (highly insulin resistant) when actually they are adult onset, slowly developing Type 1 diabetics (insulin deficient).  When I took the Type 2 training course at the hospital, the nurses warned me that folks like me (and it sounds as if it is folks like you) often need insulin within a very few years.  Right on target!  But the last year was very miserable cause I wasn’t paying attention to the RN’s warning! ! !   Be really attentive to signs that you are slowly losing insulin capacity; be very aggressive and persistent with your doc if you notice any.  I wasn’t; thus the miserable year.   2.  There are a variety of oral meds for Type 2 diabetes.  Some instruct your liver not to dump glucose into your blood so freely;  some work on your muscles to reduce "resistance to insulin" , some work on your pancreas to speed up production of insulin and thus overpower "resistance to insulin".  You and your doc will find some combo that works well when integrated into your life style and which is actually a response to the severity of your particular brand of the disease and your ability to neutralize symptoms via diet and exercise. You really ought to read up on whatever med the doc suggests and try to make an informed decision about it.  The resistance drugs are hard on the liver but the pancreas stimulators have their own problems.   Some posters report that dedication to a strong exercise and a rigorous diet program works beautifully as the only treatment.  3.  Potatoes and Pasta:  Diabetics try to eat carbo with low glycemic indices (as explained by the Mendosa site)  http://www.mendosa.com/gilists.htm In a nutshell, low glycemic foods digest more slowly. .  . usually because of their physical form.  Mashed potatoes are in the same league as straight table sugar for most of us, lumpy potatoes digest more slowly and are often acceptable.  Pasta is the slowest. I eat pasta or rice almost exclusively.  Long grain rice is slower than short grain rice.  High gluten bread is slower then low gluten bread, etc, etc,.  You must ration your carbos and often split your daily carbo into more meals (give your impaired glucose metabolism a fighting chance to keep up with your non-impaired digestive system)   Keep coming back.  Reading these forums every night has resulted in significant improvements in my quality of life. Old Al (T2 since. . .oops, T1 since 94, 35 units H + U via 4 injections daily) A retired engineer who shares his experiences. Posted Via Binaries.net = SPEED+RETENTION+COMPLETION = http://www.binaries.net

Response:

>  Three points: > 1.  The biggie!   Non-obese diabetics with a history of exercise (like for >instance, me)  often are diagnosed as Type 2 diabetics (highly insulin resistant) >when actually they are adult onset, slowly developing Type 1 diabetics (insulin >deficient).  When I took the Type 2 training course at the hospital, the >nurses warned me that folks like me (and it sounds as if it is folks like >you) often need insulin within a very few years.  Right on target!  But the >last year was very miserable cause I wasn’t paying attention to the RN’s >warning! ! !

Well, I guess this might fit me. Why was the last year miserable? What do you mean by that, please. Worked hard but unsuccessfully to keep your bg down? Suffered physical complications? What are we looking for if we’re in the situation you describe. Thanks, OldAl. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->  Be really attentive to signs that you are slowly losing insulin capacity; >be very aggressive and persistent with your doc if you notice any.  I wasn’t; >thus the miserable year. >  2.  There are a variety of oral meds for Type 2 diabetes.  Some instruct >your liver not to dump glucose into your blood so freely;  some work on your >muscles to reduce "resistance to insulin" , some work on your pancreas to >speed up production of insulin and thus overpower "resistance to insulin". > You and your doc will find some combo that works well when integrated into >your life style and which is actually a response to the severity of your >particular brand of the disease and your ability to neutralize symptoms via >diet and exercise. >You really ought to read up on whatever med the doc suggests and try to make >an informed decision about it.  The resistance drugs are hard on the liver >but the pancreas stimulators have their own problems. >  Some posters report that dedication to a strong exercise and a rigorous >diet program works beautifully as the only treatment. > 3.  Potatoes and Pasta:  Diabetics try to eat carbo with low glycemic indices >(as explained by the Mendosa site) > http://www.mendosa.com/gilists.htm >In a nutshell, low glycemic foods digest more slowly. .  . usually because >of their physical form.  Mashed potatoes are in the same league as straight >table sugar for most of us, lumpy potatoes digest more slowly and are often >acceptable.  Pasta is the slowest. I eat pasta or rice almost exclusively. > Long grain rice is slower than short grain rice.  High gluten bread is slower >then low gluten bread, etc, etc,.  You must ration your carbos and often >split your daily carbo into more meals (give your impaired glucose metabolism >a fighting chance to keep up with your non-impaired digestive system) >  Keep coming back.  Reading these forums every night has resulted in significant >improvements in my quality of life. >Old Al (T2 since. . .oops, T1 since 94, 35 units H + U via 4 injections daily) >A retired engineer who shares his experiences. >Posted Via Binaries.net = SPEED+RETENTION+COMPLETION = http://www.binaries.net

Response:

Well you certainly act quickly in case of adversity.  You found us right away and althogh we are sorry you have to be here, you will be glad you came. Just because you have diabetes does not mean that you have to give up potatoes, what you have to give up is the amount of potatoes.  Yolu can have a three ounce potato and a half a cup of cooked pasta.  Not a whole lot but it will filll the desire for it and you have to count them in your daily carbs.  There are books that will give you the carb count and the one I use is the Doctors Pocket Calorie Fat & Carb Counter with over 11000 entries including for fast food restaurants.  It is written by Dr. allan Borshuk and I got it at amazon,com I imagine that sports drinks are loaded with sugar and I really dont know what you can take in its place.  Hopefuly your doctor will refer you to a dietician who can work out a way of eating plan for you and depending on how many carbs they suggest which you will have to judge for yourself, maybe you can have a gatorade, depending on your allotted carbs.   You will need a meter and the meter is the most important aspect.  Most of us test at least 6 times a day , before meals and two hours after finishing a meal.  The two hour after finishing a meal should be below 160.  Some studies now say normal is 70 to 110 and others say 80 to 120- and that is where we want to be before meals or as close as possible.  I also check when I get up and before bed.  Solmeone told me that under 110 you can have carbs, but I have low carbs when I want them.  I cannot have too many.  I was told 180 a day and I cant really have more than maybe 60 a day or my numbers are high and that is why we test.  The dietician will suggest to you but you need to see what your body can tolerate. Good luck in your journey called diabetes and stay with us for support and info and become part of our family. Loretta If Life is such a bowl of cherries, why am I always in the pits.  Erma Bombeck

Response:

You don’t need carbs even for exercise, ask an Eskimo. — David Stites Moses Lake, WA

|Hi Guys and Gals, |I was diagnosed last Wednesday with type II. The call came from the nurse. I |see the doc tomorrow. I already have quite a list of questions for him. |I’m sure he will want to put me on an oral med. What exactly do these oral |meds do? I have already started dieting and exercising. I’m troubled about |not being able to include potatoes and pasta, they have always been my diet |base foods. |I am an avid cyclist who for many of life’s reasons has kept me away from |training/riding/racing/running for long enough for diabetes to rear it’s |ugly head. My question is, what am I to drink on a one hundred mile bike |ride if not Gatorade? The energy has to come from somewhere! |Any help will be appreciated. | |ironbyron in Owensboro, KY | | Posted Via Uncensored-News.Com – Still Only $9.95 – http://www.uncensored-news.com      With Six Servers In California And Texas – The Worlds Uncensored News Source

Response:

HI Elvis,  Nice to see you in the group glad you jumped aboard. A lot of what I would have said was said so briefly here ya go…. I hope you are getting or have gotten your meter… have it with you all the time. (Especially in the beginning… this is your new best friend) You may be able to eat pasta and potatoes … so do not rule them out yet. You may need to cut back on them. Let your meter tell you what you can tolerate. I can eat pasta or potato for breakfast or lunch but not dinner. I can eat bread for lunch or dinner but not in the morning. I cut out about 80% of the pasta, bread & potatoes I used to eat. I lived on those foods… I now eat them as sides not main courses… one must adjust. You may be put on meds you may not that depends on your bg numbers and other factors. You are on the right track and there is no reason why you can not lead a normal life. Please carry something that will tell ppl you are a type 2 diabetic especially if you are cycling alone (you really should anyway). You also should carry a tube of cake icing or glucose tablets or something like that in case you go too low with your bgs. I can tell you by my experience that bgs can drop very quickly during exercise and even while doing regular daily activity. You may want a cycling buddy or at least use a cell phone or ride in well traveled areas. My first hypo happened while grocery shopping I was fine 1 minute sweaty the next and in less than 3 minutes I was barely able to focus or stay awake I kept losing consciousness (excuse my spelling please) It was not something I would like to see happen to anyone. I never knew it could happen so fast but it does. Be careful & Take care, ANAIS ps aren’t you glad it was briefly heh heh heh!

Response:

Hi, There is a short review of meds (insulin and oral) at: http://www.rxlearn.com/diabetes/show/5/0/20010124.php3 Basic info, but you will get more infor from the folks here, you’ve come to the right place! Take care. Dave (Full disclosure:  I am involved in the site from pharmacy and nursing folks, a free service) – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – >Hi Guys and Gals, >I was diagnosed last Wednesday with type II. The call came from the nurse. I >see the doc tomorrow. I already have quite a list of questions for him. >I’m sure he will want to put me on an oral med. What exactly do these oral >meds do? I have already started dieting and exercising. I’m troubled about >not being able to include potatoes and pasta, they have always been my diet >base foods. >I am an avid cyclist who for many of life’s reasons has kept me away from >training/riding/racing/running for long enough for diabetes to rear it’s >ugly head. My question is, what am I to drink on a one hundred mile bike >ride if not Gatorade? The energy has to come from somewhere! >Any help will be appreciated. >ironbyron in Owensboro, KY

Response:

They call themselves Inuit. Like all first nations peoples, Inuit on a ‘modern’ diet have a high rate of diabetes. Vicki > You don’t need carbs even for exercise, ask an Eskimo. > — > David Stites > Moses Lake, WA

– Tough times don’t last – tough people do

Response:

As do most all Native Americans with the exception of the Iroquois. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – > They call themselves Inuit. > Like all first nations peoples, Inuit on a ‘modern’ diet have a high > rate of diabetes. > Vicki > You don’t need carbs even for exercise, ask an Eskimo. > — > David Stites > Moses Lake, WA > — > Tough times don’t last – tough people do

Response:

Printed and listed for review. Thank you Jennifer, looks like a great primer!

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Hey Dis… > Welcome to the wonderful, frustrating world of diabetes! > It’s all very murky and confusing at first, but in time, you’ll be > poking your fingers with the best of them. > Here’s the advice I give all newbies, it can help you determine a course > of action that is yours and yours alone. > Sounds like you’re planning a move to take control of your diabetes… good > for you. > There is so much to absorb… you don’t have to rush into anything.  Begin > by using your best weapon in this war, your meter.   You won’t keel over > today, you have time to experiment, test, learn, test and figure out just > how your body and this disease are getting along.  The most important > thing you can do to learn about yourself and diabetes is test test  test. > The single biggest question a diabetic has to answer is: > What do I eat? > Unfortunately, the answer is pretty confusing. > What confounds us all is the fact that different diabetics can get great > results on wildly different food plans.  Some of us here achieve > great blood glucose control eating a high complex carbohydrate diet. > Others find that anything over 75 – 100g of carbs a day is too > much.  Still others are somewhere in between. > At the beginning all of us felt frustrated.  We wanted to be handed > THE way to eat, to ensure our continued health.  But we all > learned that there is no one way.  Each of us had to find our own path, > using the experience of those that went before, but still having > to discover for ourselves how OUR bodies and this disease were coexisting. > Ask questions, but remember each of us discovered on our own what works best > for us.  You can use our experiences as jumping off points, but eventually > you’ll work up a successful plan that is yours alone. > What you are looking to discover is how different foods affect you.  As I’m > sure you’ve read, carbohydrates (sugars, wheat, rice… the things our > Grandmas called "starches") raise blood sugars the most rapidly.  Protein > and fat do raise them, but not as high and much more slowly… so if you’re > a T2, generally the insulin your body still makes may take care of the rise. > You might want to try some  experiments. > First:  Eat whatever you’ve been > currently eating… but write it all down. > Test yourself at the following times: > Upon waking (fasting) > 1 hour after each meal > 2 hours after each meal > At bedtime > That means 8 x each day.  What you will discover by this is how long > after a meal your highest reading comes… and how fast you return to > "normal".  Also, you may see that a meal that included bread, fruit or > other carbs gives you a higher reading. > Then for the next few days, try to curb your carbs.  Eliminate breads, > cereals, rices, beans, any wheat products, potato, corn, fruit… get all > your carbs from veggies.  Test at the same schedule above. > If you try this for a few days, you may find some pretty damn good > readings.  It’s worth a few days to discover. > Eventually you can slowly add back carbs until you see them affecting your > meter. > The thing about this disease… though we share much in common and we > need to > follow certain guidelines… in the end, each of our bodies dictate our > treatment and our success. > The closer we get to non-diabetic numbers, the greater chance we have of > avoiding horrible complications.  The key here is AIM… I know that > everyone is at a different point in their disease… and it is progressive. > But, if we aim for the best numbers and do our best, we give ourselves the > best shot at heath we’ve got. > That’s all we can do. > Here’s my opinion on what numbers to aim for, they are non-diabetic numbers. > FBG                        under 110 > One hour after meals       under 140 > Two hours after meals     under 120 > or for those in the mmol parts of the world: > Fasting                              Under 6 > One hour after meals         Under 8 > Two hours after meals       Under 6.5 > Recent studies have indicated that the most important numbers are your > "after meal" numbers. They may be the most indicative of future > complications, especially heart problems. > Listen to your doctor, but you are the leader of your diabetic > care team.  While his /her advice is learned, it is not absolute.   You > will end up knowing much more about your body and how it’s handling > diabetes than your doctor will.   Your meter is your best weapon. > Just remember, we’re not in a race or a competition with anyone but > ourselves… Play around with your food plan… TEST TEST TEST.  Learn what > foods cause spikes, what foods cause cravings… Use your body as a science > experiment. > You’ll read about a lot of different ways people use to control their > diabetes… Many are diametrically opposed. After awhile you’ll learn that > there is no one size fits all around here.  Take some time to experiment > and you’ll soon discover the plan that works for you. > Best of luck! > Jennifer > Hello All! > Just been diagnosed this past month with type 2, not using meds at this > point, but will be tackling the diet, weight loss, and exercise demons, and > monitoring my BG. I guess I have to establish where I am with my BG so I can > determine to what extent I have to adjust my diet. I managed to do the > denial thing quickly, so now I’m ready to tackle the giant! > I am Canadian, so from what I have learned, I use mmol/L. I’ve observed a > different level method used by many here in this group by who I guess are > Americans. Is there a conversion method so I can co-relate the numbers, or > is this a whole different scale that doesn’t relate to mmol/L? > I just discovered this newsgroup tonight, looks friendly, lots of > contributors! Hope no one minds if I sit down, put my feet up, and enjoy a > cup of tea with you all. > — > Don’t Hit Reply! > I have altered my settings to deflect evil spam. > I am…

Response:

Wow, that is a handy link! I have it "favoritized". The software in question looks good by the screenshots, I downloaded it, and plan to dig in later. Thanx! Re: Canucks… I have no idea where the name originated, sorry!

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->Hello All! >Just been diagnosed this past month with type 2, not using meds at this >point, but will be tackling the diet, weight loss, and exercise demons, and >monitoring my BG. I guess I have to establish where I am with my BG so I can >determine to what extent I have to adjust my diet. I managed to do the >denial thing quickly, so now I’m ready to tackle the giant! >I am Canadian, so from what I have learned, I use mmol/L. I’ve observed a >different level method used by many here in this group by who I guess are >Americans. Is there a conversion method so I can co-relate the numbers, or >is this a whole different scale that doesn’t relate to mmol/L? >I just discovered this newsgroup tonight, looks friendly, lots of >contributors! Hope no one minds if I sit down, put my feet up, and enjoy a >cup of tea with you all. > Hi Newbie > How did the name Canuk come to being?  The world uses one standard and > the US uses it’s own standard.  Who knows why.  Be sure to maintain > BG’s as close to non diabetic numbers as possible.  To record those > hopefully low BG’s see Sig for a software package with tremendous > graphing abilities.  It’s Free.  Good luck. > http://www.tcainternet.com/retired/index.html

Response:

> Just wondering, what numbers were you Dx’d (diagnosed) with?

That’s where the river of denial ran through! First was 2.2mmol/L, second was "no sugar at all"! (?!?!).  At this point I realized I was seeing a quack at a "drive-thru" clinic, where patients are only allowed to have one problem each, so "hurry along now, next health care claim, er, rather next patient is waiting…". Sigh. Such is the way of a for-profit clinic milking a government funded health care system. I also noted disturbing things about the collection clinic he wanted me to sample through for him, but I won’t get into that. Having lost my faith in the doctor, then the clinic, I wondered if I was diabetic at all. DENIAL! I kicked the thought around for a couple of days, and my wife suggested her doctor. She impressed my wife to be kind, knowledgeable, and she LISTENED. OK. Here we go. I told her my story, she loved my "drive-thru" title on the clinic in question, and sent me off for another barrage of tests her way, a different lab, and she got a copy of my previous results. This time, I scored 7.7mmol/L. OK, OK, I’m diabetic. Now I will deal with it. > Have you started using a meter yet?

Yep. Just picked up a One Touch Ultra Friday night. (read my tonite post "Thank You!") > How are things looking for you?

Doc thinks I can manage it well with diet and exercise for now, but emphasised the importance of staying with the program, or meds it will be. > sounding anthem than we do. Better brook (speckled) trout, and > smallmouth bass too.  We have much better baseball teams. It is good > to know what is *really* important in life.

I am Canadian (I don’t know Bob), but I am a Newfoundlander 1st. Canada is a wonderful country, but Newfoundland is an even better province. You want to hear and anthem? "Ode to Newfoundland". Brings a tear to my eye every time I hear it lately. If I could find a link to a version, I’d include it, maybe someone on Kazaa got it, I like MUN Glee Club’s version the best. > Y’all come back now, hear?

You can bet on it. Thanx for your reply.

Response:

This post not CC’d by email >Hi Newbie! >I’m also a newbie (Canadian, too).

G’day G’day Marianne,   You aren’t one of the 1200 Canadians who have entered in the competition to start a new life in New Zealand by any chance.  Of 1800 entries so far, for a free six months head start in Napier, 1200 have come from Ottawa following a newspaper article about it.  Apparently this has caused some consternation amongst the Canadian politicians. > Diagnosed with Type 2 a couple of weeks >ago.  Like you, I cannot figure out what to eat!  I’m starving all of the >time, not to mention extreme, extreme thirst.  I’m drinking water every time >I walk by the kitchen tap, and dreaming of food at night.  So far I’ve lost >17 lbs in about 4 weeks. >Breakfast is the worst because I’m allergic to eggs.  I can tolerate some >egg in cooked foods, but can’t eat a boiled egg without feeling very >naseaus.  Somehow the idea of green beans, etc. doesn’t sound too good at >breakfast time.  I’m also allergic to milk, so cereal is out.  

Marianne, I bet that has you feeling like you are painted into a corner.  Well I have some news for you.  Some corners have doors and in those that don’t there is often a handy window to scramble through. Allergic to milk?   One of the home truths for life after diagnosis is becoming au fait with details.   Do you have lactose intolerance? People often call intolerances allergies.  If you touch some milk do you get a reaction?  If you drink a few drops do you get an immediate reaction?  Intolerances are unpleasant, gradual but not fall on floor type spazzy stuff.  If the problem is lactose intolerance then it may be helpful to know that genuine yoghurt has the lactose converted to lactic acid which is not a problem.  Same with cheese.  The Mongols who probably had lactose intolerance like a high proportion of Asians solved that problem by eating/drinking fermented mare’s milk. If on the other hand you are allergic to the protein in cows milk then it is useful to know that goat’s milk protein are hypoallergenic which means almost no one is allergic them. You could of course use oat milk or soy milk. >I used to eat >cream of wheat cereal, but that seems to be pretty high in carbs.

My sister in law made famous the expression, "Wrong thing to say". Well famous in our household for instances where people innocently say something that reveals they are unwittingly being the architects of their own misfortune.  Many people have the notion that all wheat cereals are much the same.  If one isn’t OK then they generalise this to all wheat cereals or even to all cereals.   Creaming is proof positive of fine milling.  Fine milling is a very undesirable characteristic for carbs in a T2 diabetics staple food. Pearled barley is wonderful stuff for having only a mild effect on blood glucose but barley flour has a much more marked effect.  You might like to try rolled oats. Personally I don’t have the problems associated with cereals because I don’t have cereals for breakfast, I use flax fibre and berries. There is one general comment I’d like to make here and that is that as one gets blood glucose under control, the immune systems settles down and functions better.  Some food intolerances will disappear, especially if you follow what is called an anti-inflammatory diet. You can probably get a copy of Jack Challem’s "The Inflammation Syndrome" published Wiley, 2003 isbn 0-471-20271-1 >I saw a dietician, but she was useless.  Her only advice was avoid sugar and >carbs.  

Well that makes a change.  Many dieticians strongly advocate high starch, low fat diets. >If you ever figure out what to eat for breakfast, please post it. >Thanks! >Marianne

– Quentin Grady       ^  ^  / New Zealand,       >#,#< [                     / /     "… and the blind dog was leading." http://homepages.paradise.net.nz/quentin

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Just been diagnosed this past month with type 2, not using meds at this > point, but will be tackling the diet, weight loss, and exercise demons, > and > Hi Newbie! > I’m also a newbie (Canadian, too).  Diagnosed with Type 2 a couple of weeks > ago.  Like you, I cannot figure out what to eat!  I’m starving all of the > time, not to mention extreme, extreme thirst.  I’m drinking water every time > I walk by the kitchen tap, and dreaming of food at night.  So far I’ve lost > 17 lbs in about 4 weeks. > Breakfast is the worst because I’m allergic to eggs.  I can tolerate some > egg in cooked foods, but can’t eat a boiled egg without feeling very > naseaus.  Somehow the idea of green beans, etc. doesn’t sound too good at > breakfast time.  I’m also allergic to milk, so cereal is out.  I used to eat > cream of wheat cereal, but that seems to be pretty high in carbs. > I saw a dietician, but she was useless.  Her only advice was avoid sugar and > carbs.  If you ever figure out what to eat for breakfast, please post it. > Thanks!

What do you eat for lunch?  Well, eat that for breakfast (unless you can handle more carbs at lunch than at breakfast, in which case adjust it down in carbs). Leftovers can make a fine breakfast.  Cold chicken breast sliced, topped with a few slices of fresh tomato and swiss cheese then zapped in the microwave?  A few slices of ham & cheese rolled up together?  Smoked salmon and cream cheese pinwheels? Priscilla — Minutus cantorum, minutus balorum, minutus carborata descendum pantorum.   (thanks be to topfive.com)

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->Hi Newbie! >I’m also a newbie (Canadian, too).  Diagnosed with Type 2 a couple of weeks >ago.  Like you, I cannot figure out what to eat!  I’m starving all of the >time, not to mention extreme, extreme thirst.  I’m drinking water every time >I walk by the kitchen tap, and dreaming of food at night.  So far I’ve lost >17 lbs in about 4 weeks. >Breakfast is the worst because I’m allergic to eggs.  I can tolerate some >egg in cooked foods, but can’t eat a boiled egg without feeling very >naseaus.  Somehow the idea of green beans, etc. doesn’t sound too good at >breakfast time.  I’m also allergic to milk, so cereal is out.  I used to eat >cream of wheat cereal, but that seems to be pretty high in carbs. >I saw a dietician, but she was useless.  Her only advice was avoid sugar and >carbs.  If you ever figure out what to eat for breakfast, please post it. >Thanks! >Marianne

There is no need to think "traditional" when you think breakfast. Probably the traditional breakfast that includes lots of oj, cereal, milk, muffins, toast, et al, is one of the worst meals we have become accustomed to. You can eat anything you want for breakfast! One thing to be careful about though, is the fact that many diabetics are very carb sensitive in the morning. Therefore it is important to eat breakfast, yes, but be careful that it is a low carb one. I, for one, will often have a hot dog, or a 1/2 a ham sandwich, or because I can eat eggs, if I have a traditional breakfast, I will confine it to eggs and bacon, sausage, or ham. I will skip the juice and toast etc.  Hang around here for a bit, and you will be amazed at the valuable info that will come your way. Sleepy "Thats All Folks" Mel Blanc’s Epitaph

Response:

Welcome to the group for both of you.  Do a search for Jennifer’s post to newbies.  It’s information will answer almost all of your questions.  Hang in there.  With a little effort it gets easier. c

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Just been diagnosed this past month with type 2, not using meds at this > point, but will be tackling the diet, weight loss, and exercise demons, > and > Hi Newbie! > I’m also a newbie (Canadian, too).  Diagnosed with Type 2 a couple of weeks > ago.  Like you, I cannot figure out what to eat!  I’m starving all of the > time, not to mention extreme, extreme thirst.  I’m drinking water every time > I walk by the kitchen tap, and dreaming of food at night.  So far I’ve lost > 17 lbs in about 4 weeks. > Breakfast is the worst because I’m allergic to eggs.  I can tolerate some > egg in cooked foods, but can’t eat a boiled egg without feeling very > naseaus.  Somehow the idea of green beans, etc. doesn’t sound too good at > breakfast time.  I’m also allergic to milk, so cereal is out.  I used to eat > cream of wheat cereal, but that seems to be pretty high in carbs. > I saw a dietician, but she was useless.  Her only advice was avoid sugar and > carbs.  If you ever figure out what to eat for breakfast, please post it. > Thanks! > Marianne

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Just been diagnosed this past month with type 2, not using meds at this > point, but will be tackling the diet, weight loss, and exercise demons, >and >Hi Newbie! >I’m also a newbie (Canadian, too).  Diagnosed with Type 2 a couple of weeks >ago.  Like you, I cannot figure out what to eat!  I’m starving all of the >time, not to mention extreme, extreme thirst.  I’m drinking water every time >I walk by the kitchen tap, and dreaming of food at night.  So far I’ve lost >17 lbs in about 4 weeks. >Breakfast is the worst because I’m allergic to eggs.  I can tolerate some >egg in cooked foods, but can’t eat a boiled egg without feeling very >naseaus.  Somehow the idea of green beans, etc. doesn’t sound too good at >breakfast time.  I’m also allergic to milk, so cereal is out.  I used to eat >cream of wheat cereal, but that seems to be pretty high in carbs. >I saw a dietician, but she was useless.  Her only advice was avoid sugar and >carbs.  If you ever figure out what to eat for breakfast, please post it. >Thanks! >Marianne

1/2 a tea cup of porridge oats with hot water only. Pilchards in Sunflower Oil Bacon fried in Olive Oil Any form of white meat Corned Beef Fish Congrats on loosing so much weight. It gets better. Pete Diagnosed 20/03/03 Type II D&E + Metformin + Gliclazide

Response:

>>Just been diagnosed this past month with type 2, not using meds at this >point, but will be tackling the diet, weight loss, and exercise demons, and >monitoring my BG. >Here’s a help. >Feel free to email Dr. Chung directly.

especially if you like seeking medical advice from frauds and quacks. it would be safer to seek medical advice from Sister Cleo than chung the fruit cake troll.  this guy was fired from the only hospital he worked at in florida, for extremely poor quality care to his victims. Mack Type 1 since 1975 http://www.alt-support-diabetes.org http://www.insulin-pumpers.org  In tribute to the United States of America and the State  of Israel, two bastions of strength in a world filled with strife and  terrorism.

Response:

Salutations Dismantler! You don’t wear a funny mask also, do you? What’s the genesis of your handle? I was just recently Dxed also. I’m having a stereotypical HMO experience. It helped me a lot to go to Amazon and then to the bookstore (that day) and pick up "The First Year Type 2 Diabetes: An Essential Guide for the Newly Diagnosed" and "The Type 2 Diabetes Sourcebook". Then I spent about 3 hrs. reading through this group (asd) and misc.health.diabetes. Now I lurk (for the most part). Oh and btw when you talk to whoever writes your prescriptions be sure to ask if there’s more than ONE meter you can get. And mention that you’d like to take control and you want some extra strips up front. I got the Ultra Smart when the NP had only offered the lower grade one and I talked her into an extra 200 strips! Of course she now has me slotted as a snotty nerdbetic, but so what. Its ALL ABOUT ME! Cheer up, could be worse, you could have a more southern HMO. p.s could you post some experiences that you have with the Canadian system? DXed 06-12-2003 BG:231 Wt:264 Today 07-12-2003 BG:95 Wt:248 Yipee! It can be done! 2000 mg metaformin Ultra Smart (4x daily) Paper journal "It’s not much of a tail,    but I’m kinda attached to it"    – eeyore — George Abbott geabbottATabbottandabbottDOTcom Do not use t2_lurking if you want a reply! Mac | Mandrake 9.1 | XP Pro Sager 888E | G4 – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – > Hello All! > Just been diagnosed this past month with type 2, not using meds at this > point, but will be tackling the diet, weight loss, and exercise demons, and > monitoring my BG. I guess I have to establish where I am with my BG so I can > determine to what extent I have to adjust my diet. I managed to do the > denial thing quickly, so now I’m ready to tackle the giant! > I am Canadian, so from what I have learned, I use mmol/L. I’ve observed a > different level method used by many here in this group by who I guess are > Americans. Is there a conversion method so I can co-relate the numbers, or > is this a whole different scale that doesn’t relate to mmol/L? > I just discovered this newsgroup tonight, looks friendly, lots of > contributors! Hope no one minds if I sit down, put my feet up, and enjoy a > cup of tea with you all.

Response:

> Just been diagnosed this past month with type 2, not using meds at this > point, but will be tackling the diet, weight loss, and exercise demons,

and Hi Newbie! I’m also a newbie (Canadian, too).  Diagnosed with Type 2 a couple of weeks ago.  Like you, I cannot figure out what to eat!  I’m starving all of the time, not to mention extreme, extreme thirst.  I’m drinking water every time I walk by the kitchen tap, and dreaming of food at night.  So far I’ve lost 17 lbs in about 4 weeks. Breakfast is the worst because I’m allergic to eggs.  I can tolerate some egg in cooked foods, but can’t eat a boiled egg without feeling very naseaus.  Somehow the idea of green beans, etc. doesn’t sound too good at breakfast time.  I’m also allergic to milk, so cereal is out.  I used to eat cream of wheat cereal, but that seems to be pretty high in carbs. I saw a dietician, but she was useless.  Her only advice was avoid sugar and carbs.  If you ever figure out what to eat for breakfast, please post it. Thanks! Marianne

Response:

>Just been diagnosed this past month with type 2, not using meds at this >point, but will be tackling the diet, weight loss, and exercise demons, and >monitoring my BG.

Here’s a help. http://www.heartmdphd.com/losewtdm.asp Feel free to email Dr. Chung directly.

Response:

> Here’s a help. > http://www.heartmdphd.com/losewtdm.asp > Feel free to email Dr. Chung directly.

|   PLEASE   | |   DO NOT   | | FEED THE | |   TROLLS   |        |   |        |   | Regards, James the Elder

Response:

Hi dismantle,  I am just stopping by to say hello,  I cant help much with the technical stuff but I want you to know you have found a group of people who are so knowledggeable about diabetes that there wont be a question that someone cant answer. Stay with us. Loretta — In tribute to the United States of America and the State of Israel, two bastions of strength in a world filled with strife and terrorism.

Response:

: Hello All! : : Just been diagnosed this past month with type 2, not using meds at this : point, but will be tackling the diet, weight loss, and exercise demons, and : monitoring my BG. I guess I have to establish where I am with my BG so I can : determine to what extent I have to adjust my diet. I managed to do the : denial thing quickly, so now I’m ready to tackle the giant! the first thing i did when dx’d was plan on seeing a dietitain. she gave me a diet and i used my meter to see if it worked. i think it is very hard to adjust food to the numbers on the meter i think its better to have a healthy diet and use the meter to see if it works. : : I am Canadian, so from what I have learned, I use mmol/L. I’ve observed a : different level method used by many here in this group by who I guess are : Americans. Is there a conversion method so I can co-relate the numbers, or : is this a whole different scale that doesn’t relate to mmol/L? : : I just discovered this newsgroup tonight, looks friendly, lots of : contributors! Hope no one minds if I sit down, put my feet up, and enjoy a : cup of tea with you all. you seem to have a good attitude about this.. good for you. i wish you knowledge and willpower. — http://www.diabetes.org Sushi-Boy Type – 2 Dx’d January 27, 2003 also try alt.support.diabetes.uk misc.health.diabetes : : — : Don’t Hit Reply! : I have altered my settings to deflect evil spam. : : I am… : :

Response:

Welcome!  Keep posting and asking questions.  This is a great group. c

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Hello All! > Just been diagnosed this past month with type 2, not using meds at this > point, but will be tackling the diet, weight loss, and exercise demons, and > monitoring my BG. I guess I have to establish where I am with my BG so I can > determine to what extent I have to adjust my diet. I managed to do the > denial thing quickly, so now I’m ready to tackle the giant! > I am Canadian, so from what I have learned, I use mmol/L. I’ve observed a > different level method used by many here in this group by who I guess are > Americans. Is there a conversion method so I can co-relate the numbers, or > is this a whole different scale that doesn’t relate to mmol/L? > I just discovered this newsgroup tonight, looks friendly, lots of > contributors! Hope no one minds if I sit down, put my feet up, and enjoy a > cup of tea with you all. > — > Don’t Hit Reply! > I have altered my settings to deflect evil spam. > I am…

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> Hello All! > Just been diagnosed this past month with type 2, not using meds at this > point, but will be tackling the diet, weight loss, and exercise demons, and > monitoring my BG. I guess I have to establish where I am with my BG so I can > determine to what extent I have to adjust my diet. I managed to do the > denial thing quickly, so now I’m ready to tackle the giant!

<snip> Everyone else has pretty much said what I would have.  I just hope the denial thing hasn’t caused any complications from high BG.  Welcome! — Type 2 http://users.bestweb.net/~jbove/

Response:

> Hello All! > Just been diagnosed this past month with type 2, not using meds at > this point, but will be tackling the diet, weight loss, and exercise > demons, and monitoring my BG. I guess I have to establish where I am > with my BG so I can determine to what extent I have to adjust my > diet. I managed to do the denial thing quickly, so now I’m ready to > tackle the giant!

Welcome to the group no one wants to join! Get cracking on the diet and exercise plan TODAY if you want to prevent complications down the road. I was diagnosed T2 last September and have been weaned off drugs by losing weight, watching my diet and getting off my wide-load ass. It _can_ be done. Read and save the post from Jennifer, it should become holy scripture to you. Sorry to see you here. Regards, James the Elder

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – > Hello All! > Just been diagnosed this past month with type 2, not using meds at this > point, but will be tackling the diet, weight loss, and exercise demons, and > monitoring my BG. I guess I have to establish where I am with my BG so I can > determine to what extent I have to adjust my diet. I managed to do the > denial thing quickly, so now I’m ready to tackle the giant! > I am Canadian, so from what I have learned, I use mmol/L. I’ve observed a > different level method used by many here in this group by who I guess are > Americans. Is there a conversion method so I can co-relate the numbers, or > is this a whole different scale that doesn’t relate to mmol/L? > I just discovered this newsgroup tonight, looks friendly, lots of > contributors! Hope no one minds if I sit down, put my feet up, and enjoy a > cup of tea with you all. > — > Don’t Hit Reply! > I have altered my settings to deflect evil spam. > I am…

Sorry to see you have developed our disease, but very happy to see you here since you have. Remember that we are like any family and occasionally get off track and even have some cross words with one another. We always come back to helping each other with our disease though. Remember test, Test, TEST! Best of luck to you. — Chuck -

Question:

I originally took eight mgs of amaryl and I never went into a coma, amaryl can make you go low,  I take two mgs a day now with 1500 of glucophage and rarely go below 65 which is low enough for me.  You will feel either lighteheaded, or nausea , dizzy or sweating,  There will be signs,  Please carry glucose tablets with you alll the time and test, test, test so you can see if you are going low. Loretta — In tribute to the United States of America and the State of Israel, two bastions of strength in a world filled with strife and terrorism.

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>> Perhaps.  300 is a high number.   Seems likely you should have been > tired and peeing a lot.  Good for you, though … I guess … if you > weren’t.   Can you tell us what your BGS have been running since you > began treatment? >90s-low 100s when I havent ate, 130-160 after I eat. > Tell us what dosage of each medicine you are taking. >2mg of Amaryl and 500mg of Glucophage, though I havent started it yet >because I had a CT scan yesterday where they used some kinda injection dye >(even though it was clear which I thought was kinda weird) and they told me >to wait a few days before starting it.

The dye they probably use contains Iodine. > More important, you can test your blood with a glucose meter.  You can > actually see whether you are high or low.  Your post didn’t say anything > about your testing.  Do you have a meter?  Do you test?  Has your doctor > recommended testing?   Testing is crucially important.  It’s the single > best tool we have to keep ourselves healthy. >Yea it’s an Accu-check advantage, I usally use it after eating dinner and >before bed also I’ve used it a few times out of curiousty to see how foods >affected me.

Try taking a reading before meals and then after 1 hour and 2 hours for a few weeks or so. That will help you see what you can eat and what you can not. However, read the medication instructions carefully. You might discover that it will be two to three weeks before the medication is firmly established in your body. You might not see any real benefit until then – after the initial lowering.   You might suffer what is known as  a phantom hypo when the level of glucose in your blood falls below the level your body is used to. This will wear off after a while and will occurr at lower levels as your treatment takes effect. It is unlikely that you will go into a diabetic coma on the meds you are taking in the dose you have been prescribed. However, Phantom Hypo some signs and symptoms which you might experience are – tiredness that comes on quite quickly and you just want to go to sleep. If you do you will not sleep properly but the rest will allow the feeling to wear off. You might get vey irrateable and short tempered. Also there is a tendency to be unwilling to think to deeply or about complicated things. Concentration is very low. As well as all of this you may well feel hunger pains which might be quite a bit more uncomfortable than you are used to. Another side effect which does not always present itself in an obvious manner is hot feet. When I got these symptoms [and still do now and then] I either just sit quietly and chill untill it passes [about an hour] or I eat a cracker or something very small and light. You might take a blood reading to see what level these symptoms occurr at. You might find that the level is quite high and well away from a real hypo level. That should stop you from worrying about it. Durring these initial months, use you meter often. It is useful to show you what is happening to your body and will help you determine how you should respond. Don’t panic – it will take quite a few months until you get onto a road in the right direction and will make a few wrong turns along the way. But there is loads of help to hand if you want it. Pete >I just thought that if you went into a coma fast I wouldnt have time to >check it.

Diagnosed 20/03/03 Type II D&E + Metformin + Gliclazide

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – >I was just recently diagnosed with diabetes. They found out about it because >I gave blood to the Redcross and then they sent me a mail back saying I had >high liver ALTs, so I got a bunch of blood work done and my level was about >300 for two fasting tests though I had none of the symptoms they described >to me (bad eye site, tired, peeing allot, ect..) so I guess they caught it >early? Anyway to my main question. My doctor first prescribe me Amaryl and >then a couple weeks later put me on Glucophage and told me only take 1 pill >of it a day along with the Amaryl until he told me otherwise. He also told >me it might cause my blood sugar to go to low and go into a coma, now that >kinda scared me and I’m just curious from anyone here that has had too low >of a level if its easy to tell that you do? Like I wouldn’t just suddenly go >into a coma without warning would I? >Thanks for any response.

      The danger from sudden coma is mostly caused by taking insulin shots. The pills can send you low but it is more gradual. Folks taking pills can  almost always can feel a low coming and eat some sugar to stop it. Actually, most people taking insulin shots also can feel one coming and eat sugar to stop it. There are many different symptoms, but you need not experience every one when going too low.   Here is a list and a discussion:    http://www.1uphealth.com/health/hypoglycemia_symptoms.html The doctors define a "low" as a blood sugar below 70 mg/dL.      The coma level is much lower. There is a "false" or "apparent" low blood sugar phenomena which often strikes newly diagnosed diabetics.    Newly diagnosed diabetics usually suffer high blood sugars for weeks or months before diagnosis.  The high sugars somehow train their bodies to regard high blood sugar as normal. Then, when the diabetic gains control and achieves normal sugars,  his body is fooled and exhibits some of the hypoglycemia symptoms.    This can be frightening.  The only cure is to continue to control one’s sugar in the normal ranges. The false hypo symptoms stop after a while. Keep coming back.  Reading the diabetic newsgroups every evening has resulted in significant improvements in my health and quality of life. Regards   Old Al

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – >I was just recently diagnosed with diabetes. They found out about it because >I gave blood to the Redcross and then they sent me a mail back saying I had >high liver ALTs, so I got a bunch of blood work done and my level was about >300 for two fasting tests though I had none of the symptoms they described >to me (bad eye site, tired, peeing allot, ect..) so I guess they caught it >early? Anyway to my main question. My doctor first prescribe me Amaryl and >then a couple weeks later put me on Glucophage and told me only take 1 pill >of it a day along with the Amaryl until he told me otherwise. He also told >me it might cause my blood sugar to go to low and go into a coma, now that >kinda scared me and I’m just curious from anyone here that has had too low >of a level if its easy to tell that you do? Like I wouldn’t just suddenly go >into a coma without warning would I? >Thanks for any response.

since you are recently diagnosed and not on insulin it would be unlikely that you would experience a sudden hypo that did not display any symptoms.  Symptoms can include any or all of the following: trembling hands and limbs, sweating, blurred vision, headache, irritability, sudden hunger, loss of appetite, confusion.  If you feel any of these symptoms you should test your BG. Mack Type 1 since 1975 http://www.alt-support-diabetes.org http://www.insulin-pumpers.org  In tribute to the United States of America and the State  of Israel, two bastions of strength in a world filled with strife and  terrorism.

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> I was just recently diagnosed with diabetes. They found out about it because > I gave blood to the Redcross and then they sent me a mail back saying I had > high liver ALTs, so I got a bunch of blood work done and my level was about > 300 for two fasting tests though I had none of the symptoms they described > to me (bad eye site, tired, peeing allot, ect..) so I guess they caught it > early? Anyway to my main question. My doctor first prescribe me Amaryl and > then a couple weeks later put me on Glucophage and told me only take 1 pill > of it a day along with the Amaryl until he told me otherwise. He also told > me it might cause my blood sugar to go to low and go into a coma, now that > kinda scared me and I’m just curious from anyone here that has had too low > of a level if its easy to tell that you do? Like I wouldn’t just suddenly go > into a coma without warning would I? > Thanks for any response.

Not likely you’d go into a coma unless you are on insulin.  I did have frequent hypos while on Amaryl.  Some bad enough to where I passed out.  But I am not typical.  I have a thyroid problem and most likely was being overdosed on my thyroid meds at the time, making me hyper thyroid and therefore causing the food that I ate to shoot right through me.  And prior to diabetes, I had reactive hypoglycemia.  Those of us who had this first often seem more prone to hypos. I have had hypos with no warning.  I’ll feel fine one moment, then I’ll get up and immediately feel faint.  Other times, I get symptoms.  These vary from person to person.  You might feel shaky, weak, hot and sweaty, cold and chilled, dizzy, disoriented, sleepy, have a headache, have vision changes, etc.  And each hypo can be different.  So you can’t always rely on symptoms. Also keep in mind that if your BG drops suddenly, you can have symptoms of hypo without actually having a hypo.  For this reason, you need to test your BG any time you feel unwell or otherwise strange. So how do you know if you’re actually having a hypo or not?  That depends on what source you use.  If you are prone to them, then your best bet is to eat something before you get one.  But be careful!  It is very easy to overtreat and overeat when you’re not feeling well or not thinking straight.  Standard treatment for hypo is to eat 15 g of fast acting carb, then rest for 10 minutes and check again.  If your BG is still not up to where you want it, repeat. I treat as if for hypo at <80, or <100 if I am going to be active.  You may not need to treat between 80 and 100, but I do based on my past tendency to suddenly drop too low.  My brother is also a type 2 and he can spend the better part of his day around 80 with no ill effects at all.  We’re all different.  You should probably ask your Dr. what numbers he or she wants you to aim for.  If you test and find that your BG is in fact NOT low, but your still feel really awful, then eat 5 g of fast acting carbs.  This is enough to make you feel better without raising your BG too high.  But keep in mind that you are newly diagnosed and you may well feel really terrible for a couple of weeks.  This is common as your BG comes down.  So don’t rely on eating just to make you feel better.  Use this trick only if and when you are feeling so awful that you can’t stand it. What are sources of fast acting carbs?  Glucose tablets from the pharmacy, regular soda, fruit juice, gel type cake icing, and certain candies like Sweeties (the American kind, not the British kind).  Chocolate is not such a good thing to eat because it contains fat and that will delay the absorption of carbs.  But in a pinch, any source of carbs will do.  I’ve used a piece of whole wheat bread when nothing else was around.  Keep some form of carbs with you at all times, especially if you find you are prone to hypos.  Keep your meter with you too. — Type 2 http://users.bestweb.net/~jbove/

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> Perhaps.  300 is a high number.   Seems likely you should have been > tired and peeing a lot.  Good for you, though … I guess … if you > weren’t.   Can you tell us what your BGS have been running since you > began treatment?

90s-low 100s when I havent ate, 130-160 after I eat. > Tell us what dosage of each medicine you are taking.

2mg of Amaryl and 500mg of Glucophage, though I havent started it yet because I had a CT scan yesterday where they used some kinda injection dye (even though it was clear which I thought was kinda weird) and they told me to wait a few days before starting it. > More important, you can test your blood with a glucose meter.  You can > actually see whether you are high or low.  Your post didn’t say anything > about your testing.  Do you have a meter?  Do you test?  Has your doctor > recommended testing?   Testing is crucially important.  It’s the single > best tool we have to keep ourselves healthy.

Yea it’s an Accu-check advantage, I usally use it after eating dinner and before bed also I’ve used it a few times out of curiousty to see how foods affected me. I just thought that if you went into a coma fast I wouldnt have time to check it.

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>… so I got a bunch of blood work done and my level was about > 300 for two fasting tests though I had none of the symptoms they described > to me (bad eye site, tired, peeing allot, ect..) so I guess they caught it > early?

        Perhaps.  300 is a high number.   Seems likely you should have been tired and peeing a lot.  Good for you, though … I guess … if you weren’t.   Can you tell us what your BGS have been running since you began treatment? > Anyway to my main question. My doctor first prescribe me Amaryl and > then a couple weeks later put me on Glucophage and told me only take 1 pill > of it a day along with the Amaryl until he told me otherwise.

        Tell us what dosage of each medicine you are taking. > He also told > me it might cause my blood sugar to go to low and go into a coma, now that > kinda scared me and I’m just curious from anyone here that has had too low > of a level if its easy to tell that you do? Like I wouldn’t just suddenly go > into a coma without warning would I?

        No, you won’t go unexpectedly into a coma.  Relax about that.  It could happen if you over dosed, but you’d probably have to take several pills at once and then not eat.  It’s pretty easy to avoid.         Glucophage won’t make you go low.  It doesn’t work that way.  One tablet sounds like 500 mgs.   That’s a good starting dose, but most people need 1500 mg/day.  However, it’s common to start off on a low dose and gradually increase it.  It’s famous for causing stomach upset and often you need a few days for an adjustment period.     Amaryl, on the other hand, can make you go low.  It works by stimulating your pancreas to make more insulin.  Theoretically, you could stimulate it too much.   Long before you went into a coma you would notice many warning symptoms, nervousness, irritability, strong hunger, trembling, you would feel really terrible.         Treating a low is simple.  Eat something.  Preferably something that turns into blood sugar very quickly.  That would be something like a (non-diet) coke or a Lifesaver candy.         More important, you can test your blood with a glucose meter.  You can actually see whether you are high or low.  Your post didn’t say anything about your testing.  Do you have a meter?  Do you test?  Has your doctor recommended testing?   Testing is crucially important.  It’s the single best tool we have to keep ourselves healthy. — E I know you believe you understand what you think I said. I’m just not sure you realize what you heard is not what I meant.

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – >I was just recently diagnosed with diabetes. They found out about it because >I gave blood to the Redcross and then they sent me a mail back saying I had >high liver ALTs, so I got a bunch of blood work done and my level was about >300 for two fasting tests though I had none of the symptoms they described >to me (bad eye site, tired, peeing allot, ect..) so I guess they caught it >early? Anyway to my main question. My doctor first prescribe me Amaryl and >then a couple weeks later put me on Glucophage and told me only take 1 pill >of it a day along with the Amaryl until he told me otherwise. He also told >me it might cause my blood sugar to go to low and go into a coma, now that >kinda scared me and I’m just curious from anyone here that has had too low >of a level if its easy to tell that you do? Like I wouldn’t just suddenly go >into a coma without warning would I? >Thanks for any response. >I remember how upset and confused Iwas when I found

out I hat I had diabetes.   Just take it a day at a time.  Stay with the doc and watch the posts here and on misc.health.diabetes. Listen to people like old Al and Jennifer and many others that will help you.  Forget the alarmists and nuts. It will take some time. We are on your side. Many of us have been at this for a longtime and surviving. Relax and learn. Until you know more, depend on your doctor.                                              Guy

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I was just recently diagnosed with diabetes. They found out about it because I gave blood to the Redcross and then they sent me a mail back saying I had high liver ALTs, so I got a bunch of blood work done and my level was about 300 for two fasting tests though I had none of the symptoms they described to me (bad eye site, tired, peeing allot, ect..) so I guess they caught it early? Anyway to my main question. My doctor first prescribe me Amaryl and then a couple weeks later put me on Glucophage and told me only take 1 pill of it a day along with the Amaryl until he told me otherwise. He also told me it might cause my blood sugar to go to low and go into a coma, now that kinda scared me and I’m just curious from anyone here that has had too low of a level if its easy to tell that you do? Like I wouldn’t just suddenly go into a coma without warning would I? Thanks for any response.

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Question:

Wendy I dont know about stones, but the sponges that is brilliant, thanks for this handy hannah tip.   Loretta — In tribute to the United States of America and the State of Israel, two bastions of strength in a world filled with strife and terrorism.

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Don’t believe it’s rely the pumice stone but the fact that you use them to abrade the skin which can be a bad thing if your feeling is gone or low quality (that’s feeling in your feet?). They won’t let me go to a foot nurse to get my feet washed and toe nails trimmed! I mudst go to a podiatrist for that. make work for high priced personnel Elmmer > I’ve had calluses on my feet and periodically I’ve done some work with > pumice stone & lotion to get them looking normal again. > Yesterday when I went to the store, I noticed that all the pumice > stones had the warning, "Not for diabetics," while all the lotions > said "safe for diabetics". > What’s wrong with pumice stones?  I’m not eating them > -Drew

–

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>Don’t believe it’s rely the pumice stone but the fact that you use them >to abrade the skin which can be a bad thing if your feeling is gone or >low quality (that’s feeling in your feet?). >They won’t let me go to a foot nurse to get my feet washed and toe nails >trimmed! I mudst go to a podiatrist for that. make work for high priced >personnel >Elmmer

if you are only going to get your nails trimmed and feet washed, try a pedicurist. and yes it is the abrasion to the skin that is the reason behind not using the pumice stone, as well as the sterility of the stone. infections in the feet of diabetics must be garded against at all costs. M

Question:

And you can visit all the other doctor recommended, and surgeon general recommendations nutritional web sights that recommend all food groups including meat.  Lack of meat can cause many medic al problems unless accounted for by unnatural pills and such. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> . . . Beef is good for you. > No, it isn’t.  Visit: > http://www.pcrm.org > Jai Maharaj > http://www.mantra.com/jai > Om Shanti > > > THE BEEF DIET: Prescription for Disaster > > Beef eaters have really run up the health care cost in the country, > draining > > trillions of dollars from the national treasury, the funds that could be > > used for social security that would make the whole america really enjoy > life > > and not worry about retirement. > > beef eaters are a nuisance to themselves and to the nation.

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save trillions of dollars in the long run…

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Actually, meat eaters are saving the government money in the long run. People who die before they can never collect social security and Medicare. Same things happens with smokers and other unhealthy life style choices. People who die sooner save trillions of dollars in the long wrong.  This is one reason why the government increases the age limit of Social security and Medicare.  They are hopping more people will die before they can collect. People forget too take these expensive into account. People can eat whatever they damn well please.  That is freedom.  If you don’t like it, eat all the veggies you like, that is your freedom as well.

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> Actually, meat eaters are saving the government money in the long run.

Not really.  The cost of keeping the ill alive is very high. > People can eat whatever they damn well please.  That is freedom.  

Environmental terrorists and those wh rob everyone’s precious resources do not have the freedom to do so. Why do you support them — are you one of them? Jai Maharaj http://www.mantra.com/jai Om Shanti

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> > Don’t they have drug that will a low you to eat > > anything you want with out worries? > Hmm . . .  eat anything you want . . . no worries . . . are > you talking about more ways to commit suicide? > > what about grilling fatty meats how healthy are those? > Why eat corpses? > Animal eaters are just one step away from being cannibals. > there are 3 things this world don’t need: > beef, gun nuts and missionaries.

You forgot the 4th kind – those who suck Jai ‘Gandu’ Maharaj’s dick. Thanks bud. DS – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Jai Maharaj > http://www.mantra.com/jai > Om Shanti

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You got it all wrong bud. Beef is good for you. Just don’t eat too much. Fast food is bad full of fat and carbohydrates and less protein. Cigarette, alcohol cost billions in health care not beef. Thanks everyone. DS

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> THE BEEF DIET: Prescription for Disaster > Beef eaters have really run up the health care cost in the country, draining > trillions of dollars from the national treasury, the funds that could be > used for social security that would make the whole america really enjoy life > and not worry about retirement. > beef eaters are a nuisance to themselves and to the nation.

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> > Don’t they have drug that will a low you to eat > anything you want with out worries? > Hmm . . .  eat anything you want . . . no worries . . . are > you talking about more ways to commit suicide? > what about grilling fatty meats how healthy are those? > Why eat corpses? > Animal eaters are just one step away from being cannibals.

But, isn’t that what you were convicted of when you brutally slaughtered your gay lover Swami Pradyumna and eat the poor guy’s corpse over a period of days??? Readers can verify this by searching the Google using the key words ’swami pradyumna’. Thanks everyone. DS – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Jai Maharaj > http://www.mantra.com/jai > Om Shanti

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> . . . Beef is good for you.

No, it isn’t.  Visit: http://www.pcrm.org Jai Maharaj http://www.mantra.com/jai Om Shanti – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> > THE BEEF DIET: Prescription for Disaster > Beef eaters have really run up the health care cost in the country, > draining > trillions of dollars from the national treasury, the funds that could be > used for social security that would make the whole america really enjoy > life > and not worry about retirement. > beef eaters are a nuisance to themselves and to the nation.

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> > Don’t they have drug that will a low you to eat > > anything you want with out worries? > Hmm . . .  eat anything you want . . . no worries . . . are > you talking about more ways to commit suicide? > > what about grilling fatty meats how healthy are those? > Why eat corpses? > Animal eaters are just one step away from being cannibals. > there are 3 things this world don’t need: > beef, gun nuts and missionaries.

If you count three, yes, but change "beef" to meat. If four (the maximum allowed), then include errorists. Facts about terrorist Islam and Muslims http://www.flex.com/~jai/satyamevajayate Jai Maharaj http://www.mantra.com/jai Om Shanti

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How about a couple of nice fried ham steaks then, would that be ok? RB – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> . . . Beef is good for you. >No, it isn’t.  Visit: >http://www.pcrm.org >Jai Maharaj >http://www.mantra.com/jai >Om Shanti > > > THE BEEF DIET: Prescription for Disaster > > Beef eaters have really run up the health care cost in the country, > draining > > trillions of dollars from the national treasury, the funds that could be > > used for social security that would make the whole america really enjoy > life > > and not worry about retirement. > > beef eaters are a nuisance to themselves and to the nation.

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Everything is bad for you in the wrong amounts.  And yes I eat meat, like most Americans too much.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> You got it all wrong bud. Beef is good for you. Just don’t eat too much. > Fast food is bad full of fat and carbohydrates and less protein. > Cigarette, alcohol cost billions in health care not beef. > Thanks everyone. > DS > > THE BEEF DIET: Prescription for Disaster > Beef eaters have really run up the health care cost in the country, > draining > trillions of dollars from the national treasury, the funds that could be > used for social security that would make the whole america really enjoy > life > and not worry about retirement. > beef eaters are a nuisance to themselves and to the nation.

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> > Don’t they have drug that will a low you to eat > anything you want with out worries? > Hmm . . .  eat anything you want . . . no worries . . . are > you talking about more ways to commit suicide? > what about grilling fatty meats how healthy are those? > Why eat corpses? > Animal eaters are just one step away from being cannibals.

there are 3 things this world don’t need: beef, gun nuts and missionaries. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Jai Maharaj > http://www.mantra.com/jai > Om Shanti

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> Don’t they have drug that will a low you to eat > anything you want with out worries?

Hmm . . .  eat anything you want . . . no worries . . . are you talking about more ways to commit suicide? > what about grilling fatty meats how healthy are those?

Why eat corpses? Animal eaters are just one step away from being cannibals. Jai Maharaj http://www.mantra.com/jai Om Shanti

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posted: >Beef eaters have really run up the health care cost in the country, draining >trillions of dollars from the national treasury, the funds that could be >used for social security that would make the whole america really enjoy life >and not worry about retirement. >beef eaters are a nuisance to themselves and to the nation.

Before I set yet another killfilter.. are you serious? Linda Bushisms: "You’re free. And freedom is beautiful. And, you know, it’ll take time to restore chaos and order – order out of chaos. But we will." George W. Bush, Washington, D.C., April 13, 2003 Join us in the Diabetic-Talk Chatroom on UnderNet /server irc.undernet.org — /join #Diabetic-Talk More info: http://www.diabetic-talk.org/

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Don’t they have drug that will a low you to eat anything you want with out worries? what about grilling fatty meats how healthy are those? — http://www.diabetes.org Sushi-Boy Diabetics Do It With Out The Sweets

: : > THE BEEF DIET: Prescription for Disaster : > : : Beef eaters have really run up the health care cost in the country, draining : trillions of dollars from the national treasury, the funds that could be : used for social security that would make the whole america really enjoy life : and not worry about retirement. : : beef eaters are a nuisance to themselves and to the nation. : :

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> > THE BEEF DIET: Prescription for Disaster > Beef eaters have really run up the health care cost in the country, draining > trillions of dollars from the national treasury, the funds that could be > used for social security that would make the whole america really enjoy life > and not worry about retirement. > beef eaters are a nuisance to themselves and to the nation.

They are a burden on everyone, and they also contribute to the destruction of everyone’s environment.  They are environmental terrorists. Jai Maharaj http://www.mantra.com/jai Om Shanti

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>>>>>>sorry you don’t want us eating cow…but it ain’t sacred here!! >>>>>hawki >>>> Good.

Excellent! Got mangoes, boya?

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->Every single day in the United >States, 4,000 lives are taken by heart >attacks and almost >nothing is being done about it. > say again?? > 2000 statistics: 515,204 deaths…. > try multiplying 4000 x 365 days > approx 1.5 million.. > don’t know where that stat came from …but it is triplely wrong

That’s par for jyotishits(asstrollogers).

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>>sorry you don’t want us eating cow…but it ain’t sacred here!! >hawki > What do you have against preventing disease?  A fact: > "A vegetarian diet can prevent >  97 percent of our coronary occlusions." >   – "Diet and Stress in Vascular Disease," >      Journal of the American Medical Association, >      Vol. 176, No. 9, June 3, 1961, page 806.

A vegetarian diet can lead to excessive bile production, with it’s attendant ill-effects. It can also lead to mental retardation. Exhibit 1: "Dr." Jai Maharaj, aka Jay Stevens aka Johnny Maharaj, conman extraordinaire. Got mangoes, boya?

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> THE BEEF DIET: Prescription for Disaster

Beef eaters have really run up the health care cost in the country, draining trillions of dollars from the national treasury, the funds that could be used for social security that would make the whole america really enjoy life and not worry about retirement. beef eaters are a nuisance to themselves and to the nation.

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> Every single day in the United >States, 4,000 lives are taken by heart >attacks and almost >nothing is being done about it.

say again?? 2000 statistics: 515,204 deaths…. try multiplying 4000 x 365 days approx 1.5 million.. don’t know where that stat came from …but it is triplely wrong sorry you don’t want us eating cow…but it ain’t sacred here!! hawki

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> sorry you don’t want us eating cow…but it ain’t sacred here!! > hawki

What do you have against preventing disease?  A fact: "A vegetarian diet can prevent  97 percent of our coronary occlusions."   – "Diet and Stress in Vascular Disease,"      Journal of the American Medical Association,      Vol. 176, No. 9, June 3, 1961, page 806. Jai Maharaj http://www.mantra.com/jai Om Shanti

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>What do you have against preventing disease?  A fact:

nothing…just don’t appreciate very misleading statistics…. hawki

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->>>> sorry you don’t want us eating cow…but it ain’t sacred here!! >>>> hawki >> What do you have against preventing disease?  A fact: >>> "A vegetarian diet can prevent >>>  97 percent of our coronary occlusions." >>>   – "Diet and Stress in Vascular Disease," >>>      Journal of the American Medical Association, >>>      Vol. 176, No. 9, June 3, 1961, page 806. >>> Jai Maharaj > nothing… > hawki

Good. Jai Maharaj http://www.mantra.com/jai Om Shanti

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THE BEEF DIET: Prescription for Disaster By Dr. Neal D. Barnard President, Physicians Committee for Responsible Medicine Washington, DC http://www.pcrm.org Imagine if two jumbo jets collided over a major city and, in the resulting fireball, 4,000 people died — it would be a national tragedy — one of the worst accidents ever. People would demand that airlines and the government made sure nothing like that could ever happen again. A tragedy of this proportion happened the day before yesterday. It happened yesterday, too. It will happen again today and tomorrow. Every single day in the United States, 4,000 lives are taken by heart attacks and almost nothing is being done about it. For years now, we have known of the role diet plays in health, yet unhealthy diets are still promoted by the government, livestock industries, advertisers, and even doctors. Healthy diets must be presented and encouraged by these groups if America’s health care crisis is going to be solved. Dietary changes are worth making. Two of the three leading killers of Americans are heart disease and stroke. Both are linked to "hardening of the arteries" — arteriosclerosis — which, in turn, is largely caused by high-fat, cholesterol-laden diets. As we all know, animal flesh, and beef in particular, is a major source of cholesterol and saturated fat. The enormous toll of these diseases is taken one patient at a time, as doctors finally give up trying to resuscitate yet another heart that is damaged beyond hope. The toll is also felt in the national pocketbook. Coronary bypasses and expensive diagnostic tests are now the budget-breaking routine in every city in America. Many other diseases also have their roots in our daily meals. Breast cancer, which has reached epidemic proportions, killing one woman every twelve minutes, is clearly related to diet. The same connections have been drawn between diet and cancers of the colon and prostate. In fact, according to the National Cancer Institute, some 80 percent of cancer deaths are attributable to smoking, diet, and other identifiable and controllable factors. Foods rich in fat and oils increase our cancer risk. About 40 percent of all the calories we eat comes from the fat in meats, poultry, fish, dairy products, fried foods and vegetable oils. These fats stimulate the over- production of hormones which encourage cancer and promote the development of carcinogens in the digestive tract. Not only are beef and other meats high in cholesterol and saturated fats, but they are also low in some vital vitamins and minerals, and they contain zero fiber. Recently there has been enormous scientific attention given to the role beta-carotene and other vitamins and minerals play in blocking cancer growth. Whole grains, fruits, legumes, and vegetables are full of vitamins and minerals. And plant foods have fiber — a substance completely lacking in beef and other meats. We have long known that fiber helps eliminate many common gastrointestinal problems such as constipation; however, evidence shows that it also is protective against a wide variety of diseases ranging from colon cancer to diabetes, and from gallstones to appendicitis. It also binds with carcinogenic substances, bile, and excess hormones which would otherwise rest in the digestive tract, and moves them out of the body. As one studies the diets of people around the world, one thing becomes clear: as people give up traditional diets that are low in fats, high in fiber, and predominantly plant-based in favor of beef and other meats, the incidence of diseases such as cancer, heart disease, diabetes, and kidney disease rises. At the same time, life expectancy and quality of life decline. In recent years, Japan has been the target of American beef and tobacco promotional campaigns that seem to be some sort of Pearl Harbor revenge program. Members of the higher socioeconomic strata, who are adopting Westernized diets, have much higher rates of breast, colon, and prostate cancer and heart disease than their counterparts who eat less (or no) meat. The Beyond Beef campaign is encouraging people to make this simple change — to step away from beef. It is a move that is good for you, for others, for animals, and for the environment. So live a little; try some new cuisine; experiment with traditional and ethnic foods. It could well help you live a lot healthier longer.      Dr. Neal Barnard is President of The Physicians Committee For Responsible Medicine, a nationwide group of physicians that promotes preventive medicine and addresses controversies in modern medicine. In April 1991, he and three other doctors unveiled a proposal to replace the old Four Food Groups concept initiated in 1956.      In his book, "The Power of Your Plate," Dr. Barnard documents the scientific evidence supporting a low-fat, vegetarian diet as the most potent regimen to reduce risk of heart disease, cancer, weight problems and food-borne illness. Aside from serving as a practicing physician on the faculty of the George Washington School of Medicine, he is also an Associate Director for Behavioral Studies at the Institute for Disease Prevention.      Dr. Barnard is a director of Behavioral Studies at the Institute for Disease Prevention at George Washington University. Visit http://www.pcrm.org Jai Maharaj http://www.mantra.com/jai Om Shanti Panchaang for 19 Jyeshtth 5104, Wednesday, June 18, 2003: Shubhanu Nama Samvatsare Uttarayane Nartana Ritau      Mithun Mase Krishna Pakshe Buddh Vasara Yuktayam Dhanishtth Nakshatr Vishakumbh Yog      Taitil-Gar Karan Panchami-Shasthi Yam Tithau Hindu Holocaust Museum http://www.mantra.com/holocaust Hindu life, principles, spirituality and philosophy http://www.hindu.org http://www.hindunet.org The truth about Islam and Muslims http://www.flex.com/~jai/satyamevajayate      o  Not for commercial use. Solely to be fairly used for the educational purposes of research and open discussion. The contents of this post may not have been authored by, and do not necessarily represent the opinion of the poster. The contents are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.      o  If you send private e-mail to me, it will likely not be read, considered or answered if it does not contain your full legal name, current e-mail and postal addresses, and live-voice telephone number.      o  Posted for information and discussion. Views expressed by others are not necessarily those of the poster.

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Question:

Hello folks, Any experience with Subway sandwiches?  I recently learned about that low-fat sandwiches ads but a little higher carbs.  I ate roasted chicken breast sub sandwich with wheat bread and american cheese (estimated 47g carbs).  I know that it might be too high for some. My BG tests showed that: 0 hr – 84 (fasting) Ate roasted chicken sub 1 hr – 117 2 hr – 120 (peak) 3 hr – 111 Thank you. Tim Stark

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It looks like you can eat them, 120 peak is real good. I wish I could.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Hello folks, > Any experience with Subway sandwiches?  I recently learned about that > low-fat sandwiches ads but a little higher carbs.  I ate roasted chicken > breast sub sandwich with wheat bread and american cheese (estimated 47g > carbs).  I know that it might be too high for some. > My BG tests showed that: > 0 hr – 84 (fasting) > Ate roasted chicken sub > 1 hr – 117 > 2 hr – 120 (peak) > 3 hr – 111 > Thank you. > Tim Stark

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i one time had a general tos chicken combo with 1 1/2 cups of friend rice, egg roll, duck sauce, and that wonderful general tos chicken. the highest i seen was 126. i myself also have subway sandwiches from time to time. i simply ask them to gut the bread.  since i found out i can handle much more carbs than the dietitian had given me.  i have been having a hard time in losing weight. that is why i don’t eat only to my meter ( when i have the will power ) if i did i would surely gain every pound back and than have a real problem controlling the blood sugar.  if you are looking to lose weight you have just lost a great help in the battle.   you now know you can eat more. good luck to you. — http://www.diabetes.org Sushi-Boy DIABETES for some its a curse for me its a cure

: Hello folks, : : Any experience with Subway sandwiches?  I recently learned about that : low-fat sandwiches ads but a little higher carbs.  I ate roasted chicken : breast sub sandwich with wheat bread and american cheese (estimated 47g : carbs).  I know that it might be too high for some. : : My BG tests showed that: : : 0 hr – 84 (fasting) : Ate roasted chicken sub : 1 hr – 117 : 2 hr – 120 (peak) : 3 hr – 111 : : Thank you. : Tim Stark : :

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I’ve had some success with a Subway sandwich with much of the bread innards taken out before they put the filling in. There’s enough left of the outside to hold things, but not so much of the puffy bread part. bj – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – > It looks like you can eat them, 120 peak is real good. I wish I could. > Hello folks, > Any experience with Subway sandwiches?  I recently learned about that

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> Hello folks, > Any experience with Subway sandwiches?  I recently learned about that > low-fat sandwiches ads but a little higher carbs.  I ate roasted chicken > breast sub sandwich with wheat bread and american cheese (estimated 47g > carbs).  I know that it might be too high for some. > My BG tests showed that: > 0 hr – 84 (fasting) > Ate roasted chicken sub > 1 hr – 117 > 2 hr – 120 (peak) > 3 hr – 111

I can eat one of their small tuna subs and my BG is fine afterwards.  I don’t care for them at all though and I’m still hungry after I’ve eaten one. — Type 2 http://users.bestweb.net/~jbove/

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– http://www.diabetes.org Sushi-Boy DIABETES for some its a curse for me its a cure

: >i one time had a general tos chicken combo : >with 1 1/2 cups of friend rice, egg roll, duck sauce, : >and that wonderful general tos chicken. : >the highest i seen was 126. : >i myself also have subway sandwiches from time to time. : >i simply ask them to gut the bread.  since i found out : >i can handle much more carbs than the dietitian had given : : Howdy Sushi, : : That’s a good tip, gutting the bread, and it’s one I have been using : for some time. As you state, you can get more into the sandwich, and : for me that’s bell/hot peppers and lettuce and tomatoes. : : Gen Tos Chicken is also a fav of mine. : — : Terrell : type 2, metformin 500mg per day. What’s up Terrell: gotta get them hot peppers.  i tell them to load it up with everything they have.  i also gut my bagels. hmm i wonder who makes the thinnest slices of bread? maybe pettridge farms? omg Gen tos chicken or shrimp hmmmm. i do limit such meal to about 1 every 1 or 2 months. i think i had it 3 times since dx’ed.  for me it isn’t about numbers its about losing weight I am having a very hard time now.  i am not gaining thank god. Sushi-Boy

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Hey Sushi! Wanna’ fix your SIG so it’s at the _END_ of your messages rather than the beginning? Many of your replies appear to be "empty" responses and I wouldn’t want to miss any of your deathless prose. I see you’re using OE6 for your newsreader, have you accidentally set your SIG as your message header? Regards, James the Elder

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It seems to me that with your numbers you can do that sub,  I on the other hand would only be able to eat one half the bread to get readings like yours,  This is really a case of ymmv.  I would be spiked with the whole 47 carbs. Loretta — In tribute to the United States of America and the State of Israel, two bastions of strength in a world filled with strife and terrorism.

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That’s why you take the inside part out of the bread (roll) — it greatly reduces the carb count while still leaving something to hold onto & contain the filling. bj

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> It seems to me that with your numbers you can do that sub,  I on the > other hand would only be able to eat one half the bread to get readings > like yours,  This is really a case of ymmv.  I would be spiked with the > whole 47 carbs.

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bj I take the insides out of a half a bagel,  I really dont do subway but that is a good idea, two crusts are better than one. Loretta — In tribute to the United States of America and the State of Israel, two bastions of strength in a world filled with strife and terrorism.

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> bj I take the insides out of a half a bagel,  I really dont do subway > but that is a good idea, two crusts are better than one.

With all the delis we have here in NY, I see no need to go to Subway.  And yet they have them here. — Type 2 http://users.bestweb.net/~jbove/

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> With all the delis we have here in NY, I see no need to go to Subway.  And > yet they have them here.

I have no NY style delis in my area, more a large city thing here but I find Subway a very cheap alternative to get a large salad, made up of what I want, and a selection of meats and cheeses.  I have never paid more than $4.90 au for a large meat, fish or cheese or combo salad.  I often buy one for dinner to take home when I have no kids to cook for or if they are having takeaway meals.  A similar salad in a NY style deli would be much more than $4.90, so Subway wins for me Hard not to order a six inch bun though, lol.

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>> bj I take the insides out of a half a bagel,  I really dont do subway > but that is a good idea, two crusts are better than one. > With all the delis we have here in NY, I see no need to go to Subway. > And yet they have them here.

Stop it Julie you’re killing me! God, the lunch sandwiches we’d buy at the deli across from school. You could make dinner out of what you couldn’t finish at lunchtime! Regards, James the Native New Yorker

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– http://www.diabetes.org Sushi-Boy DIABETES for some its a curse for me its a cure– http://www.diabetes.org Sushi-Boy DIABETES for some its a curse for me its a cure I DON’T KNOW WHY YOU ASK BUT I WILL LOOK INTO IT. http://www.diabetes.org Sushi-Boy DIABETES for some its a curse for me its a cure — http://www.diabetes.org Sushi-Boy DIABETES for some its a curse for me its a cure http://www.diabetes.org Sushi-Boy DIABETES for some its a curse for me its a cureSAD_SPAMMER– http://www.diabetes.org Sushi-Boy DIABETES for some its a curse http://www.diabetes.org Sushi-Boy DIABETES for some its a curse

: : Hey Sushi! Wanna’ fix your SIG so it’s at the _END_ of your messages rather — http://www.diabetes.org Sushi-Boy DIABETES for some its a curse for me its a cure: than the beginning? : — http://www.diabetes.org Sushi-Boy DIABETES for some its a curse for me its a cure : Many of your replies appear to be "empty" — http://www.diabetes.org Sushi-Boy DIABETES for some its a curse for me its a cureresponses and I wouldn’t want to : miss any of your deathless prose. : — http://www.diabetes.org Sushi-Boy DIABETES for some its a curse for me its a cure– http://www.diabetes.org Sushi-Boy DIABETES for some its a curse for me its a cure : I see you’re using OE6 for yo– http://www.diabetes.org Sushi-Boy DIABETES for some its a curse for me its a cureur newsreader, have you accidentally set your : SIG as your message header? : — http://www.diabetes.org Sushi-Boy DIABETES for some its a curse fo– http://www.diabetes.org Sushi-Boy DIABETES for some its a curse for me its a curer me its a cure : Regards, :– http://www.diabetes.org Sushi-Boy DIABETES for some its a curse for me its a cure : James the Elder : : :

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> I have no NY style delis in my area, more a large city thing here but > I find Subway a very cheap alternative to get a large salad, made up > of what I want, and a selection of meats and cheeses.  I have never > paid more than $4.90 au for a large meat, fish or cheese or combo > salad.  I often buy one for dinner to take home when I have no kids to > cook for or if they are having takeaway meals.  A similar salad in a > NY style deli would be much more than $4.90, so Subway wins for me > Hard not to order a six inch bun though, lol.

I’ve never gotten one of their salads.  But since I always keep salad in my fridge, there really is no need for me to buy any.  I would assume that what they use for their salad is the same shredded iceberg that they put on the sandwiches, but I could be wrong.  If so, I’m not really interested in that. — Type 2 http://users.bestweb.net/~jbove/

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Julie depending on the deli you talk about, subway is more reasonably priced and it is a chain,  I dont know if they do as well here as they do in other parts of the country,  I think I have had it twice and Blimpies maybe three times in my life. Loretta — In tribute to the United States of America and the State of Israel, two bastions of strength in a world filled with strife and terrorism.

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> Julie depending on the deli you talk about, subway is more reasonably > priced and it is a chain,  I dont know if they do as well here as they > do in other parts of the country,  I think I have had it twice and > Blimpies maybe three times in my life.

I’ve never had a Blimpie.  I have had Subway because I used to have one near where I worked and another near where I lived.  Can’t say that I cared for their sandwiches.  They were mostly bread and shredded iceberg lettuce with little else in there. — Type 2 http://users.bestweb.net/~jbove/

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I can eat them, too… I think we are lucky, though.  :-) Linda – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – >It looks like you can eat them, 120 peak is real good. I wish I could. > Hello folks, > Any experience with Subway sandwiches?  I recently learned about that > low-fat sandwiches ads but a little higher carbs.  I ate roasted chicken > breast sub sandwich with wheat bread and american cheese (estimated 47g > carbs).  I know that it might be too high for some. > My BG tests showed that: > 0 hr – 84 (fasting) > Ate roasted chicken sub > 1 hr – 117 > 2 hr – 120 (peak) > 3 hr – 111 > Thank you. > Tim Stark

Join us in the Diabetic-Talk Chatroom on UnderNet /server irc.undernet.org — /join #Diabetic-Talk More info: http://www.diabetic-talk.org/

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